“Shaping Laws through ‘Gin Running in Spirit’” 

“Jim Jones and Trusting Self to be your own Authority”

“There are Many Big and Small Ways to be Leaders”

“Our Goddess Heart-Self Natures”

“Fears Are Discouraged Aspects of Self”

Session 306 (Group/Dinner & A Dead Gal)

Saturday, November 22, 2008

Participants: Joanne (Tyl), Paul (Caroll), Jeanette (Esohna), Nardine (Daisy), Tom, Caryn, Christoph, Ester, George, Gordon (Gilbert), and Rumi the Cat.

(Rose arrives 4:36 PM. Arrival time 21 seconds.)

ROSE: Now, we’ll begin with the allowance for the elections to be discussed tonight, okay? How about that for a set of interesting topics this evening, dear ones? How about the comments from the Australian tonight, dear one? How about giving us your impressions about the United States elections from your vantage point, dear one?

NARDINE: Good evening to you, Rose. Thank you. I will acknowledge that I have paid little attention to the media since dearly elected Barack and his wife’s coming to their position. All I know is that in my world, in my house, I see it as a great sign of affirmation unto the planet. And as an example of this, another loving couple, who are in a position to project to all of us ways and manners of doing things integrally. I think they’re a beautiful example.

ROSE: Well said, dear one. Now how would you characterize how you feal about the elections? Indifferent, in some ways, perhaps, because you’re not in exactly the same way involved as the United States’ citizens, indeed. But you do have a sense that they are very interesting times, don’t you?

NARDINE: Absolutely, absolutely, yes.

ROSE: So you have a sense …

NARDINE: And …

ROSE: Go ahead.

NARDINE: I was going to say, as a reflection of the shift upon the planet, we in Australia just last November, a year ago, we elected a new Prime Minister. And it was a gentleman of integral love and forward-movement of character where there’s caring about everyone, not just certain parts of the populace. And his wife, he and his wife, they’re another beautiful, loving example unto the planet that we have in our little country here. And I just see the wave moving out, moment by moment, many different ways that we are bringing to the awareness of everybody. And from my perspective, which I’m not very … I don’t pay much attention to the media, or politics, all I know is that within my heart I know that Barack Obama and his wife are leading all of us through our heart awareness in a way that is integral to everybody. (Humorously) So forgive me, I’m not very ofay[1] on that aspect of my world (Laughs). I just look at it through my heart, that’s all.

ROSE: Indeed. There is reason to suspect that you have a better take on the situation than you could know sometimes, dear one. You do allow much intuition about the situation. You have a sense that the individuals that you nominated into your cabinet were also the same ilk that the very wonderful Obamas are. Correct?

NARDINE: Correct.

ROSE: That is to say that there are, really, many ways that you have of getting to the truth of things without needing to stop to figure out the menial tasks of reading foreign newspapers.

That’s exactly why we wanted to speak with you first, dear Daisy, because the reasons you have for doing the things you do are in heart-ways, so as to allow your best expressions. Now you do that very well. Now you have a sense also that the Obamas have heart-sense about them, too. That’s exactly correct. They have a sense of heart-ways. You have to say the mental things are very important also, but the heart-sense is more so sometimes. We’ll explain.

You have a sense of heart in your exactly, beautifully, honed intentionality name: Heart Whisperer. The heart whispers always. Your hearts wanted to have those in power that had this sense also. Why not consider that they have heart-sense that you can consider always moving out into the world, in every direction, in spite of the physicality involved with their proximity in your United States of America? Indeed, they have many reasons to fear not that they will not do the job. They already have, in many ways. They have made the case for heart-sense in the world, dear Daisy. So you’re indeed very correct that you held them in heart-space in ways that others sometimes miss.

So do continue to express the ways of spirit in your heart-sense, for there are many reasons to help yourself to his contrary self nature in order to allow your own heart-sense in the world. We want to assure you, you don’t need to fear that they will be stopped. The sense of heart-space is in the air, in hearts also.

So do continue to feal this beautiful energy in your world wherever you are, so as to allow your best expressions also, for things are changing, indeed. In every day that you live now, there will be a very wide growth as well as acceleration, in many ways, of the shift in consciousness, as well as heart-space. There are not many reasons to think these are different, but in some ways they are. For the shift will carry in it many things about the way of spirit, but heart-sense is a very important one that you are finally, in some ways, getting to allow into your world.[2]

We’ll allow your questions, dear one, but we need to point (Chuckles) out that the weany girl has a suggestion that she wants to share, so we’ll share (Chuckles) it for her. The weary girl – we call her (Chuckles) that – the weary girl has an impression that the contrary Dick Cheney had a somewhat troubled sense of heart-space, the reasons being that he did physically incapacitate himself, heart-wise, in many ways. That’s exactly correct. These are really the vestiges of an old-fashioned, stuck view about the body, as well as the mind, as well as how the heart wants to support the many things that the body, mind, and spirit also want for you.

So do continue to allow your questions as well as comments. The reason for doing so is because you do know that the game is on, indeed. So do so. Please, go ahead.

NARDINE: May I make an acknowledgment from that, please, Rose?

ROSE: Yes, please do, dear one.

NARDINE: Firstly, may I acknowledge, thank you for putting me on the spot like that (Laughs), because the process of this has allowed me to recognize that I can fully trust my intuitions, no matter whether they’re in my immediate world or across the planet. And I can express those intuitions and knowings without having to – once again – slip into my pattern of discounting or doubting the value of my knowing. And you asking me that question, my immediate response was to slip back into the discounting, uninformed pattern of expression, instead of trusting that expressing through my heart is enough (Laughs).

I don’t have to have or hang onto all the old judgments that would make me feal as though they’d be more valid in the perceptions of others. So I appreciate very much that you have, in these last few minutes, allowed me to honor more knowingly my intuitions through my heart without having to have the other stuff around it. Thank you!

ROSE: Exactly. You’re very welcome, dear one. That’s exactly why we wanted to start with you, for you have a very big heart-sense in many ways. That’s why your Roses talk to you in many ways also, for your heart-sense is what Rose is all about, indeed. In every way, the heart-sense has been overlooked – not ignored completely – but overlooked in many ways. So do continue to express to yourselves how very important it is to allow the heart to thrive in every way. Do continue, dear one.

NARDINE: I have nothing else on that. I’m just sitting here smiling from my heart out (Laughter). Thank you.

ROSE: Good. Very good. Any other questions, indeed, or comments about the election?

PAUL: I just want to say, way to go Nardine.

NARDINE: Thank you (Laughs).

PAUL: I want to acknowledge her acknowledgment about being put on the spot and not discounting self – it’s such a knee-jerk reaction. So good for you. You go girl!

NARDINE: (Humorously) I’ve been skinning my knees a couple of times this week and I keep getting up! (Laughs)

PAUL: Get back on that horse, that’s right.

NARDINE: You betcha.

ROSE: Even Rose doesn’t know all things. Even Rose skins her knees in the metaphysical sense also. So don’t ever think that we know all things either. You can say we’re dimwits in many ways.[3] So do continue to allow yourselves to express the beauty of your very natures in order to allow the best selves, indeed. So do so. And you have a question, dear weary boy?

PAUL: No.

ROSE: No?

PAUL: No, no question. I’m trying to think of a comment on the elections, but nothing’s popping up in the meantime.

ROSE: We’ll continue, if you’d like, to take on Rose about the election, or we’ll allow your questions about any topic.

PAUL: I have a quick question for you that popped up. Because Tom asked a question about six weeks ago, or longer, about Obama and the elections coming up, to kind of see what your take was on it. And you come out, really, and endorsed Obama in a sense, and acknowledged that he would be a better choice, although you also stated that there’s really no bad choice. McCain would have been okay, too, in the bigger picture.

But looking in this now, and trying to just wrestle with the simultaneous nature from your perspective of probabilities: was it a much closer election in probabilities than we’ve been led to think by this landslide of electoral votes? Or, from your perception, was it a time, and it was a most probable thing? And then the corollary to that is, the economy tanked four weeks before this election and, it’s like, it came out of nowhere, and it was a godsend for that. So if you would comment on that in terms of probabilities, too.

ROSE: You just called the recession a godsend, didn’t you?

PAUL: Yeah, I did, inadvertently.

ROSE: Indeed. And that’s correct, indeed. It was for your allowance for him to take the cake, so to speak. He had to allow the election to go either way, but there were some reasons to allow the other one to take the lead on the election. We’ll say “that one”[4] – we’re joking, of course. But the McCain-inspired version of your shift is very interesting for you. He would have done things the weary world would have allowed in ways the interesting times would have not.

In some ways, the times were more ready than the individuals were. In many ways, the times wanted to change. You have a sense the times have to do some things. The collective, in many ways, had to change. The ways that you go about these changes aren’t always what you think they’ll be. So in this intentional way, the McCain supporters would have thrived, in many ways. But these were not the ways that you needed to go ahead in the world. The times had their say, in some respects. They needed your elections to go in another way. The times are the shift. The shift has to happen. You’ve decided that, to help your ways of spirit. The times had to go one way, the McCain election would have gone another way.

Now we don’t mean to allow a critique of McCain in the sense that he would have dragged the shift down. In some ways, he did not want to take the reigns. He didn’t want to do the job. He thought he did. He desired the fame and fortune in some ways, but he truly did not want the job of realizing the presidency. He knew, inside, that McCain followers would not be the right ones to lead your country.

He did not even, in many ways, stay true to his own intentionality. He did change in the years before the election. He didn’t want to allow the best self to thrive, in some ways, because he knew that he wouldn’t get the consideration of President of the United States. He did want to allow the ontologically suspect presidency to rest in another’s hands. Ontologically suspect in the sense that sometimes the respect that is incurred in the realization of the presidency isn’t all it’s cracked up to be. The respect that is engaged, in some ways, is not truly desired. There are a very many individuals who want the presidency to go away, in the countries that allow terrorism, for example. He didn’t want that. He wanted to allow the right person to take over. Deep down, he did.

In many ways, he allowed the election to take place the way it needed to take place. Of course, he did play a very crucial part in allowing the choices he made to be considered the worst ones by even his own party, didn’t he? So he undermined the allowance for the respectful (Joanne laughs), resentful, people in charge of his party to take the reigns. So he did allow the presidency to take place in every way, you might say.

Now, that’s not to say that if he were to be elected, that he wouldn’t be a good president. He might have. But he didn’t want the job, so he didn’t want to take the reigns. In some ways, if that had occurred – he did want to take the job, for example – then he would have allowed his version of the shift to occur in your country as well as in the world by allowing, for example, the wars to continue in ways that you would call in many ways suspicious on the part of the allowance of other countries in regard to your country, indeed. They were in many ways needing to be stopped. The wars, in some ways, were to be stopped by your many hordes of individuals who were not going to put up with these wars anymore.

So there were ways of allowing the shift in other respects, other than the election of Obama. But these were not the ones you wanted. Indeed, the ones you wanted were heartfelt in many ways. They are very respectful of individuals – even terrorists, indeed. So do continue to allow your best selves to be continuing under a government that is in many ways expressive of your deepest desires. Do continue to allow your questions.

TOM: I have an election question.

ROSE: Indeed.

TOM: In California there was a Proposition Eight, and although with the election Mr. Obama would seem to make a big stride forward in certain ways, the failure of this proposition – or actually the passage of this proposition – has seemed to bring to the forefront a conflict between a broadening of secular civil rights and the religious traditional hierarchy. Could you address that with regard to the way of spirit and the shift, please?

ROSE: We love “way of spirit” questions, dear one, indeed we do. Now we’ll say that the way of spirit is in some ways the same as the way of self. For example, the way of self has you having the marriages you want to have, indeed. To marry your lover is a very … (Pause)

JOANNE: (Laughs) I don’t know what this word is! Sorry.

PAUL: She’s making one up.

ROSE: Ginto way – G-I-N-T-O – meaning, gin running in towards spirit ways. You want to run gin in spirit in the same way you needed to do so in the great drying out period in the (Joanne laughs) Depression, in a sense. There were many ways of getting around the law then, correct? – when you were dry. In spirit, you had what to say about law? In the same way your (Joanne chuckles) absolution is in every way the same as the ways of getting the gin you did in the 1920s. So you had ways of getting the gin, correct, then?

You had ways of getting the law in your hands, so to speak. You did what? You had the law in your hands because you had the gin in your hands during the prohibition, correct? So you had the gin in your hands the same way you have the law in your hands now. You do it. You just do it now. You don’t need to have the laws to teall you how to live your lives.

Now you do, in many respects, need to allow your lower-level individuals to do what they need to do with the gin also. They have the law in their hands also, don’t they? The law is suddenly – how do you say – very accessible now in spirit, more than it ever was. The law is in many ways more accessible than you have ever thought of it before. So that’s why you’re creating the really interesting challenge that – of all places, in California – is happening now.

Indeed, you’re correct that it is somewhat of a disparity in spirit, in some ways, in regard to how your laws are very protective of how the ways of love have to offer themselves to your benefit. So you’re correct that this is how your laws sometimes need to become more accessible to you. So you can drink in fully the ways of spirit in your laws, as well as to shape your laws in ways that have you doing the running, indeed. So do you have any further questions for Rose?

TOM: Could you address the resistance of the traditional religious hierarchies?

ROSE: Always, they always do that. That’s their job, indeed.

TOM: To resist.

PAUL: To conserve, to be conservative – the old ways.

ROSE: Here’s how you can think of them, indeed. They have ways of getting to the truth of things that are very distorted, in some ways, but in other ways they are very right, you could say. They have an ethical sense about them that is very accurate in some ways, but the fears of self have to get in the way, in some ways, before you recognize that self is not bad. They are you, but bad, in some ways.

So think about this in this respect and you’ll have a sense that they need to allow more of self in order to be happier, indeed, so as to not fear their sexuality, for example, to not fear their way of getting on their cases about things too much. You do this also when you fall into the category of disparity, in some ways. So do continue to allow your greater selves to pull you from that morass, in some ways. And the way to do that is indeed in doing what? In allowing your way of spirit, indeed.

That’s why they’re wanting to allow themselves to heal themselves, because they want to also. They want to thrive also, but they can’t really do so because they do tune into their lower selves in many ways that harm them, indeed. Lower selves in the sense that they do see themselves as sinners, not in tuning into their lower selves as something of the animalistic, wild self that we mean sometimes in [describing lower] selves.

So do take on their ways because they want to thrive also. They need you to call them on things at times. But to consider them secular is how you can try to dismiss their claims of godliness. They are not godly in our sense of the word. Continue to allow yourselves to think of them as secular beings who try to connect with God, but have a difficult time, at times. To take on God is an everyday affair, not just the thing you do on Sundays, indeed.

Do you have any additional questions, dear one?

TOM: Here’s a follow up. So with the shift, I would think that these religious people – traditionally religious people – would resist that rather than embrace that, but I gather the shift is coming anyway, so how will they be affected by it?

ROSE: Excellent question. They will in some ways check-in and some ways check-out. You can dismiss them, in some ways, because they will continue to do what they do, in some ways, without moral majority. But to say they will also check-in to their selves is a way of thinking about them. Some will take on their wider selves. Some will drop out, some will self-destruct, because that’s how they go about doing that, right? They do self-destruct in every way. When your authorities are caught in bed with the gay prostitutes, indeed. What’s that? Their denial of their own sexuality, indeed.

So they do catch up with themselves in every way. Then they allow themselves to do what they don’t want others to do. That’s how they take on their best selves also sometimes; they do allow themselves to experiment in safe ways. But to say that they’ll be able to connect in bigger ways is an understatement. Some will, in many ways, thrive in your shift. We’ll hope so, because they are decent people, basically. Some are not really good, but in many respects, they are.

So you want to allow them to thrive in every way. Some take on environmental causes, for example. Some take on sexually the things they want to do, then they change the rules. Sometimes they want to express to others how beautiful they are in spirit. These are all very good things. So do continue to ask your beautiful questions about how to engage these individuals, for they are, in many ways, suffering now, and don’t know exactly how to proceed, indeed. So do so.

PAUL: I have a comment coming off of that, and since half of us here were at the workshop three weeks ago, I want to put an integral spin on what we were just talking about, that basically the issue of gender, sexual orientation – even orientation as Elias and Rose define it – and sexual preference is considered a typology. It’s a type. So whatever stage you’re at – seedling, sapling, tree – that gender, orientation, and preference is present there. And so that’s from the individual perspective, and then when we scale this up into systems theory – because integral is really all about systems and looking at global and cosmic systems – we have a traditional, and a modern, and a postmodern worldview space that roughly follows the seedling, sapling, tree.

And in this now, the estimates are that the traditional worldview space, with its gender, orientation, and preference, is holding about forty percent of the population – at least in the western democracies – the modern worldview approximately thirty percent, and the postmodern approximately twenty-five percent. If I’m adding it up right, that’s ninety-five percent, and that leaves some room for the earlier and what’s leading edge coming out of that.

So when the traditionalists can still lobby and organize with the modern ones, that’s a seventy percent majority, so that’s still, that’s a very close, this traditional-modern… it overlaps a lot. So seventy percent is still locked into the way things have always been done, kind of – even for centuries, in modern terms – and then for thousands of years, for example, the minister says, “We’ve had marriage defined as a man and woman for five thousand years,” to which an integralist would say, “Yes, but what about the two hundred thousand years before that? Why is that not factored in?” “Well, we don’t know, we don’t remember our history, really, more than five thousand years.”

So in terms of this shift, final thought, is that this movement is pushing that twenty-five percent postmodern, where the gender, orientation, and preference, the gay and lesbian choice is “different strokes for different folks,” let people do what they want to do, and even grant them same rights, is still in a minority. And the shift in this global sense is going to see a push into a majority of that modern-postmodern alliance. And I think that’s what we’re going to be seeing in the next forty or fifty years in particular, and the traditional one will still be there, because people are born at stage one, they grow up, and they’re given their myths – Santa Claus, Easter Bunny, and Jesus. And, you know, there’s mythical elements to all of those that we outgrow as we mature.

ROSE: You’re exactly correct that the myths need to change in order to allow their stories to connect in real ways with spirit, indeed. For to say that the world was created in seven days, then left to rot, or whatever it’s been doing all these years, is not correct. The intentionality of your stories is very different than the reasons the religious individuals have for interesting themselves in distorting them. They distort them for power. They are distorted for reasons that you’ll consider evil[5], indeed.

So do take on your stories about the beginnings, in many ways, of your universe, indeed, so as to allow your citizens of the Earth to continue to thrive in ways that align with these stories, so they don’t feal set adrift by these stories, indeed. So do so, and we’ll assist. (Group laughter)

Do continue to allow your questions and comments, dear ones.

CARYN: I’ve been thinking lately a lot about Jim Jones and Jonestown. I was watching a documentary on this last night, and it seems like it could have been such an amazing, beautiful thing. He had this seemingly amazing idea of equality, and, you know, at that time that was right after the civil rights movement, and people were so open to this and it seemed like … it’s hard to tell if he was picking up on the energy of this, of wanting to change things and then using that, or if it just became distorted over time.

ROSE: You do need to allow your question to take hold in individuals’ minds. We’ll explain a bit more about Jim Jones, but your question is excellent, dear one, because the reasons you have of fearing realization of inclusion has to do with your fear about that also. So you want to include yourselves, in many ways, as citizens of the world, but you fear the Jim Joneses’ take on things also.

We’ll explain a bit about the allowances the people of Guyana had, first of all. He had a very strong personality that had them transfixed in many ways. They were captive audiences because he was the very strong individual that he was. He promised them a life inside the club, in many ways. These were also individuals who were set adrift, in some ways, in their communities. They did not fear the personality at first, but they did in the end. They did want to have a – sometimes, promise, of – paradise.

In his ways of getting to paradise, he needed to totally control them. He needed to control them. They were realizing the safety of losing their individual choices in order to allow the others to control them. In some ways, they had not grown up in ways that they needed to. To be the adults, they needed to take on the adult he was to them. They were children in some ways. They were not the wonderful selves you are, in some ways. They were very taken by – surprised by – this, in many ways, geanius man.

Now, he did have a self-sense that had a sort of fearlessness about him that they clung to also. He was a very skillful practitioner of people. He helped them control themselves, in some ways, but not the things they needed to. They controlled the senses in some ways. He helped them control their lives. They held him in high esteem, because they felt highly regarded at first, then they did not when he felt they did not allow him to control [them]. In other words, he manipulated them very much.

The thing to realize that he did, that you can say is in danger of happening in the world again, is that he took advantage of individuals who had a sense of paradise in them, and he did feed this belief, but you don’t need to give up your control in order to feal paradise in you. This was the big difference. Your paradise is in you always. This is about the religious self also. The religious self sometimes confuses the inside paradise with the outside paradise. They lived in paradise, in many ways, but he manipulated them to fear the very world they lived in also.

So when they wanted to allow him to take charge, he did so. Then he did what? He had them kill themselves. What to say about that? How would anyone in their right mind allow that, indeed? He was a psychopath, a sociopath, indeed. Both are true about Jim Jones. He was both in Rose’s view, for he held himself so highly respectful of power that he did not use his… what? (Inaudible response) Exactly, and his heart-sense also. So his heart-sense was nonexistent. This is what psychopaths do: they don’t use their hearts. They use their minds, they use their bodies. They don’t allow their heart-sense to thrive, so they allow only their thoughts to move themselves into areas that have no moral ground, in some respects.

So when you allow them to take charge, they will hurt you, indeed. And sometimes you don’t know the differences between those in power who have heart-sense from those in power who don’t. And this has to do with the elections, indeed, doesn’t it? In every way, the elections were about allowing governance for the people to thrive, and the only way you can do this is to allow heart-sense into your lower and higher level officials, indeed. It’s everything about governance, in every way, in every sense of governance, because when you, indeed, very well govern the things you do every day, you hold people accountable for reasons that have to do with your own heart-sense, don’t they? The reasons have to do with allowing them to thrive also.

So in allowing your heart-sense, you have more to your power, indeed, than you ever imagined before. So the heart-sense is in every way the most important thing you might do, indeed, for yourselves, as well as for the individuals in the world. Indeed. Do you have an additional question?

CARYN: When, as far as having a wide heart-sense, or a very narrow or almost non-existent heart-sense, is this something that our essence intends for a focus when it manifests a certain focus? Is that something that is intended for that focus, or is it something that occurs?

ROSE: That’s an excellent question. The intentionality is never to harm others. The intentionality is always to allow hurtfulness to end, on your part as well as on others’ parts. So the intentionality is always about helping, never about hurting. So you’ll continue to thrive as soon as you connect with your intentionality.

So to say that the intentionality is not what he did is incorrect also. These are very subtle things. The intentionality could have been to use, in some ways, the powers he had to allow himself to heal them. He could have done this. He did have many ways of allowing helpfulness to others, in spite of his disease, you could say, because he did not want to, deep down, harm others. He was a sociopath because he was in pain also. So to say that someone could have stopped him is an understatement. He did run amuck. So he did want to allow his compassion to thrive. This is the way of spirit. It’s in you, indeed. But to say that his intentionality was served is not correct. The intentionality was to heal, not to harm, indeed. Did that answer your question?

TOM: Can I tack onto that? In the case of Jonestown, his followers chose to kill themselves or kill their loved ones?

ROSE: They did.

TOM: So could you address the co-creation that was going on with Jim Jones?

ROSE: There were aspiring, powerful individuals who wanted to take over, who did want to allow the deaths also. So there were a few who did support Jim’s cause in ways that did backfire on them also. They wanted to allow themselves to take over. They did not want to have the followers who were to imbibe the Kool-Aid, so to speak, without knowing how they’d turn out. In other words, it was in some ways a mistake that the Kool-Aid was ingested. There were many who did not want to partake, but who were talked into it also.

So there were individuals who wanted to take on the deaths, because they were indeed difficult to deal with, in some ways. The leaders who wanted to take over from Jim Jones had ways of wanting others to take on the Kool-Aid in order to make waste of them. There were some who were also very murderous who wanted to take over his ministry.

But the thing to keep in mind is that some individuals were truly suicidal. They were truly unhappy individuals who were thriving very well before Guyana was in some ways taken over earlier in that century. Then they did not want to allow themselves to continue under the rule of Jim Jones. They were tired. They were hurting. They did not at all trust themselves in order to allow themselves to thrive. He in many ways made them suffer before. The disease of mind, as well as spirit, were the causes of the deaths, not the Kool-Aid. So did we answer the question?

TOM: For my part, yes, thank you.

ROSE: Any other additional questions?

PAUL: I’d like to circle back to Caryn’s question about heart-sense – and you answered her question in terms of intentionality – and I’m just trying to feel my way through this new concept, as we all are. And I just have connected with heart-sense to feeling-tone, and further to empathy – the ability to walk a mile in another person’s shoes. They seem very related in the fact that when someone’s pathology, their psychological state, dips into that sociopathic and psychopathic area where that calcifies, or somehow it … they’re not able to do that, they don’t care, it all becomes a reflection of their own egoic self. So if you would just comment on the connection between heart-sense to feeling-tone and empathy.

ROSE: They do not love themselves at all. In many ways, this is the same thing as not loving others. You can only love yourself as much as you love others and vice versa. These things do happen in accordance with your growth as providing-of-happiness individuals. In many ways, you have to learn to allow love into your hearts in spite of how you may view yourselves at times. Sometimes you don’t want to allow this because you don’t love each other, or you don’t love self. There are many ways to view these things, but to say these are different is not the case, they are the same. You can only allow love for yourself when you love others and vice versa. It grows on, in some ways, each thing in ways that allow your allowance in both regards – back and forth, in some ways.

So you can trust that the ways of spirit are about the ways of self, as well as the many other individuals in your lives who need love. There are many ways to express this in spirit, but to say that to love others is the way of spirit is an understatement: these include yourselves, indeed. Did we answer the question?

PAUL: Yeah, and I’m just gathering here that the heart-sense is about learning to love self so that you can learn, so that you can love others. There’s an interesting parallel with Elias’ accepting self first, so that you can accept others. And yet his definition of acceptance is a little different than love and the heart-sense, but there … it’s an interesting correlation there. So anything else … I guess the heart-sense and its connection to our intention, I don’t know, it’s an interesting new concept to play with. It’s sort of a connective tissue concept that I’m getting a lot of pointers to others things on. So any other comments you want to make on that.

ROSE: We’ll wrap up this first set of questions before you have your beautiful dinner. But to say this another way: you have the dots, you need to connect them. The way of spirit is the heart-sense in many ways, connecting the dots, in a sense. So we’ll leave you with that, as well as to say, Amen! Aaaaaaahhhmmenn. (Singing, and Jeanette chimes in)

NARDINE: May I make an acknowledgment? (laughs)

ROSE: Indeed, go ahead.

NARDINE: Connecting those dots has been my bliss for a couple of decades, because I will acknowledge that my journey of loving-of-self is eternal. But in this life, it began in the 80s when I learned that I had to – not had to – but to love myself, to fill myself with love, to overflowing was the most blissed and blessed way for me to love others. And so the course I’ve steered all these years has been always to love, allow, and embrace myself. But I hadn’t got to where I’ve got in recent months, or this year, of – as Rose pointed out to me, too – giving to myself as much as I give to others. I have loved myself all those years, but I had not given the allowance and acceptance, nor had I actually got to the final layers of some of those very limiting programs and patterns that were discounting and disallowing.

So between the steps with Elias, and Kris, and Rose, and my own working, moment to moment, which is love guidance, because every intention within every moment for myself is to express love. So I find it so absolutely magical that … and at the same time I’m learning to allow – not discount – my heart-light, my heart-whispers, my heart-truth. I’m finding that I actually have done a lot of this work and it’s so blissful (Laughs) to feel as though it’s having its value now. And that’s my heart-whisper (Laughter).

ROSE: There is nothing more we can add to that, dear one, indeed. That was a very wonderful, heartfelt expression of how we want to assist, in many ways, every individual that has allowed themselves to discover the Rose-selves they are. We’ll allow your further questions after your delicious break. Do continue to be the beautiful selves that you are, indeed, dear ones.

PAUL: Alrighty, thank you Rose.

NARDINE: Lovely.

ROSE: You’re very welcome.

NARDINE: Thank you.

BREAK: 5:35 PM.

RESUME: 6:08 PM.

ROSE: You have many authorities involved in your every decision, don’t you, in some ways? You have essence. Sometimes you have leaders who instill in your visage a sense that there are things to take on, in your terms. For example, perhaps you have the need for a wonderful individual to take on bullies in your neighborhood. They would be considered leaders who, for example, allow a petition to be circulated to stop invasions of privacy. For example, you have ways of getting into things that require the leadership of other individuals, such as paperwork that may need to be done. Or leaders in sorely needed areas of starvation, who take it upon themselves to take up the cause that they will help end hunger in individuals who need that.

There are other types of leaders who do small things, like attending to spiritual ways that incur the wrath of many. They may hold prayer meetings in countries that do not allow religion. These are very contrary spiritual ways that individuals need to take leadership of, or there will be totalitarian states in many ways. There are other types of leaders that in some ways are even smaller. Sometimes you have to tell someone to stop doing something, to move their cart into another place in the store if it’s blocking someone’s way.

There are many ways to be leaders. In many ways, when you listen to your contrary self, that’s exactly what you get: the allowance for your own sense of leadership. In many ways, you’re allowing your inner authority to contribute in ways that are very important. In many ways, the smallest ways are the very best ways, too. The small ways have many ripples that spread out into other areas in need, too.

So do continue to trust your own authorities, indeed, to teall you things that you need to know. Do continue to ask any questions this evening, dear ones.

(Long pause) Dear Christoph?

CHRISTOPH: Yes.

ROSE: We have not heard from you this evening. Would you like to ask Rose a question tonight?

CHRISTOPH: Yes. I was thinking about my intent name, and I tried to imagine the best thing I can do in the world. And I guess my intent name has to do with helping people to release the fears in their life.

ROSE: That’s in every way a geanius impression. We want to take on the rest of the evening just about the intentionality name you came up with, because the way of spirit for many is exactly this. But you have more to do with this than meets the eye, in some respects – more than others, to say the least, do also. We’ll explain a bit first about your own ways of spirit, dear Christoph.

You have a sense that spirit moves you into new areas of healing already. You have many ways to do this. You help others look at fears in order to assess how the fears have to go on their way in order to allow their health to flourish. You have ways of saying “I love you,” in spite of your fears. These are also beautiful ways to express healing, for when you have the fealing that you’re loved, you do heal in every way also.

There are ways you have that could be described as intuitive in healing ways. You intuit the things that others need to address in their bodies. You have a sense that their bodies’ interests in fears have to do with their specific illnesses. There are ways that you arrive at dis-ease controls – we’ll say these aren’t exactly controls in the sense that you can control the dis-ease – but you can see things in spirit that have to do with control issues that interpret themselves in individuals’ bodies also. Control issues have to do with fear as well.

So you have many ways of using your intuitions about people’s fears in helping them allow their healing, as well as ways of interpreting their fears in ways that help you heal them also. So you have many paths to use in your persistence in healing, that is to say, the persistence you have in allowing fear to help you heal them in spiritual ways, indeed. The way of spirit for you is in every way informed by fear – in every way, in decidedly useful ways, that is – for fear is the friend or foe that you need to help you. And they will do that, indeed, fears will.

So don your medicine hats, all of you, for we want to say more about the wonderful topic that Christoph has raised this evening, for you have many ways to heal yourselves that have to do with your fears. Okay?

We’ll begin with the weary girl this evening. She has fears about breathing. Her ways of fear help her to breathe. They allow her to breathe in essence in spite of her fears, in some respects. In other words, she has decided to have a fear of breathing, for she doesn’t fear the breath, she fears her lack of worth in breath. So she does what? She stops breathing sometimes. She really does stop breathing at times.

This has allowed her to get affection from her family in ways that are helpful. In some ways, helpfulness comes because of the fear, instead of in spite of the fear. The helpfulness can be, in some ways, taken on when you allow comfort for someone who is hurting. So the fear helps you do what, in that case? Get attention. The fear can help you move into areas of health as well as hurtfulness, too. Sometimes fear helps you healthily intrude on yourself for allowances for yourself of pity also.

So fear has ways of getting your health bad, then what? It says, “Well, I helped you, didn’t I? I helped you get what you needed to have: the pity, the self-allowance for rest,” at times. So fear helps you [get some] needs met by allowing yourselves to fear, then allowing the fear to take hold in ways that are not healthy for the body. So fear has many positive effects. In spite of how you fear death, or pain, or dis-ease, it is fear that is [also] the very wrong way to get to the needs.

So fear does help you get the needs met, but we’re not suggesting for a moment that you continue to do so, for this is not the most efficient means to get your needs met. But it is one way that fear does this. Also, fear helps you move into new areas. You can say, “Hey, we are so very needing of fear to help us get into the way of spirit,” that we’ll discuss this now.

Sometimes you have to hurt on yourself to get your attention. You have ways of doing what? Stopping your flow. You don’t have ways of getting around as well. Why? You have a way of finding hurtfulness in your feet perhaps. Why? You need to allow yourself to move, perhaps, but you don’t want to move. So what does fear do? It allows itself to hurt your feet in order to say, “Hey, I don’t want to have this controlling force on me that controls my very movement and limits my ability to move around. I want to address the fear that is getting in my way of finding movement.”

Or you say, “I want to address my sight issues, because I want to see better, but I have a fear of what I might see, indeed.” So to see things sometimes is not a good thing to you. Don’t you sometimes fear what you might see? Indeed. Why not say, “I can’t be hurt by anything I might see, so allowing my sight is a very good thing. My fear can allow itself to address the things I need to, like what to do with the things I see. What can I do to address the injustices, for example, that I might see?” rather than saying, “I fear that, so I will not see.”

Okay? Do you “see” the differences – to not make too terrible a pun – now, dear ones? So your getting the fears into your purview, in a sense, is a very geanius thing to do, because they help you move into new areas that are truly astounding for you, in every way. Your Christoph is a healer in every way, because he is wanting to move into areas of healing expression that the world needs desperately now.

Do you hear what we’re saying Christoph?

CHRISTOPH: Yes.

ROSE: The world needs you to do exactly what you’re doing, dear one. So do continue to allow your deep understanding that you have of the exciting world of Elias, as well as Seth, as well as Rose, to continue to inform your everyday world in your wonderful way of spirit, as well as your need to address the very intentionality that you’ve expressed tonight, dear one. Okay?

CHRISTOPH: Okay.

ROSE: Do you have any questions, dear Christoph?

CHRISTOPH: I don’t know how to put my intent into a name. So perhaps you can help me.

ROSE: That’s easy. You’re a “Fear Healer.” Try that one on for a while.

NARDINE: Beautiful.

ROSE: You’re wanting to allow fears to be allowed, then healed. So try this one on for size, dear healer, Christoph, and allow yourself to see how this works for you. It’s not up to Rose to change your intentionality name for now, but we will suggest this as a means to move into the sort of space that will help you get the next one on your own. Okay?

CHRISTOPH: Okay. Thank you.

ROSE: Okay, dear one. Very geanius way of spirit, dear Christoph, you’re doing a wonderful job. Do continue to allow your wonderful essences to assist always also. Now, do you have any further questions for Rose this evening, anyone?

PAUL: I have a comment on Christoph’s intent name work. It’s really excellent, Christoph, and I wrote down here, “helping people to lose their fears is a really powerful nugget to continue to work on.” And I’ll just say, I continue to do some work in the last three weeks myself on my intent name. We talked about it three weeks ago in the workshop that we did – it was one our practices that we explored – and I have this very cosmic sounding thing, and with three, sort of, sub-intents that I check back on. But I wanted to take it to the next level, and to try to put it into an intent name, a single thing that describes those three common elements.

So I had a lengthy meditation on that and got a bunch of impressions, and it’s very similar, Christoph, to what you came up with. So you’re very close, actually, I think, to describing this theme of your journey through this life, because it’s not any particular destination, or accomplishment, or trophy, or action in the life. It’s this larger theme.

So anyway, I got this impression of exploring how things work. The common element in lucid dreaming, music, and teaching is how things work. And then I added … well, to make an intent name, I added, “explorer of.” And it’s a typical male, common orientation sort of “doing” action word, explorer, and I thought, “okay (Laughs), Rose, and her heart-sense, and this fealing tone, and empathy,” and I got into “fealer of how things work.” And the notion of “fealer” of how things work, it doesn’t roll off the tongue in a sexy way like the Sumari phrase does, and yet, that’s where I’m at, that’s as far as I’ve gotten with it. It’s kind of holding my attention right now, and I will be going back over that in the weeks ahead.

So “fealer of how things work” just kind of captures that very general theme for me. And it’s very close, Christoph, to helping people lose their fears – you know, “helper of people losing fears,” would be one way to put that into English and an intent name.

ROSE: Healer is a very interesting word for “healer of fears.” We mean healer of fears, not dismisser of fears. Not telling fears to go away, but allowing fears to say things to you that you need to know about.

The fears hold much information for you. All you need to do is allow them to talk to you, to tell you exactly why they want to assist you, or why they want to assist your patience, indeed. So fears help you in every way to move beyond the fear of fears also, don’t they dear ones? There’s no need to fear fears. That’s exactly why you need to heal them. They need healing and love, too. Okay? So try to think about fears in this way, not as your foes. For they only want to be allowed to be let go. So do so, and we’ll allow your questions also tonight.

Do you have any fears you’d like to share tonight to help you move into new areas that you may not have thought of before, dear ones? You all have them. Why not share them a bit, if you’re comfortable?

ESTER: I have a fear of, like, now I’ve been struggling, what do I ask? Because I do have things I want to ask but I’m, like, this is, like, a group, and I shouldn’t be wasting space (Group laughter).

ROSE: There’s that fear of what? Indeed, wasting space. Indeed (Group laughter). So why you would think about wasting space is a problem, correct? We suggest that you need to allow yourself to think of this as a very wonderful expression, in some ways. You have much to say, but you have to allow others to express their views also. Why not consider your fear is about allowing yourself to not pay attention to yourself as much as you need to?

In other words, you have a very wonderful way of allowing others their berth, don’t you? There are many reasons to not fear this, indeed. This is actually a very wonderful, compassionate view of the world. Why not say to yourself, “I have this need to allow others to say their piece, then I can fear only that I will take up more time than is my fair share.” In other words, you can gauge how to move in the world based on your beautiful sense of compassion rather than a fear that you’re taking up space or time in others’ days. Okay?

So addressing the fear as a friend – that is, a very good friend, in helping you see how you are a very wonderful person – is a way to see it as your friend, not foe. Okay? Now that you have the floor, dear one, is there something else you’d like to say tonight, indeed (Group laughter)?

ESTER: I guess I just wanted to share a little story of my conversation with you before, about authority. And it was a wonderful experience of how I had mentioned to you about Hecate, and how that word meant so much to … you know, had come to me. And you had pronounced it differently. And I had spent two, three days trying to get in touch with the same word, how you had pronounced it. But it didn’t mean anything to me.

So I’m driving, and I have this class where we had to, not impersonate, but embody a goddess. And of course I chose the one that had been calling me for a while. And on my drive to this place, I kept thinking, trying to have your pronunciation in my head, you know like, “pronounce it this way, this is the right way.” And I’m halfway there, and then I got it! (Laughs) I just started laughing, because it would be like your way to do it, you know, like the tests (Laughs).

ROSE: Exactly. The tests are exactly that, yes.

ESTER: Like, you were testing me. Because, as soon as I do it my way, the way that I used to – Heck-ah-tay – which is the way for me, I’m there! But the other one – Heck-ate – doesn’t mean anything. It’s, like, just this floaty thing. I just laughed all the way there. I could just hear you laughing about it (Laughs).

ROSE: Indeed, there are many reasons to not trust how we allowed the expression, because the weary girl was moving into areas of trusting self in ways that were funny. The weary girl was doing the autotyping, not hearing our Rose voice, so she could only spell the word, not hear the pronunciation. She didn’t get it right. There’s no reason to think she should get it right, indeed, because there’s reasons to believe that your way of pronouncing any word is the way you should pronounce any word.

Now you also mentioned the tests, and this is an excellent idea to raise to the group, because there are ways that you have of avoiding tests, to say the least. When Rose confronts you with a test, that’s exactly why she does that: to help you learn to trust you own inner authority, not Rose. Okay?

So there are many seeds of wisdom in what you just shared, dear one, because you did allow her, Rose, to teall you things you needed to know. You sorted the things you needed from the things you didn’t need, then you allowed yourself to do what? Move into new areas of what? Authority, right?

ESTER: Yeah.

ROSE: So you allowed yourself to truly trust your own expression of the godhood in your (Joanne chuckles) H-E-C-A-T-E. I’ll let you decide how to pronounce that this evening (Group laughter). Weary girl doesn’t want to go there, indeed (Group laughter). So do allow your continued questions if you wish, dear one. This is a very excellent thread you started.

ESTER: Yeah, I think that was the most powerful thing – that as soon as I got it, I felt powerful, like I had the choice. It was my life, and I had the choice to decide how it was pronounced, and what I was tapping into, and what I needed to express and …

ROSE: That’s exactly right, indeed. Your goddess, indeed, was speaking directly to you, wasn’t she? Rose is her in some ways also. There’s many reasons to feal the goddess all around you, no matter how you wish to call her. So Hecate – we’ll use your pronunciation – is your goddess, you could say. In spite of how you fear that word, there are reasons to mythically portray the inner self as goddess or god.

So we’ll use this term because you need the term to exist in your way of spirit. You’re gods, you’re goddesses, you’re Heck-ates (Group laughter), you’re Roses, you’re in every way all these things. So to call your goddesses something is important to you, indeed, isn’t it? Not just a very wishy-washy idea of inner self, the names are important, indeed. So do continue your wonderful expressions in spirit, dear ones.

ESTER: Yeah, I know, because now that you’ve pronounced it, it was only in the last – that was a few weeks ago – and only in the last, probably, three days that I’ve been doing a lot of meditations, I’ve been getting in touch with that Heck-ate pronunciation, and it feels very similar, but it is … now I can tap into it, once I was able to tap into the other one. So just the different levels, and different sideways feeling of it, it’s just slightly different, a slightly different taste to it, or feeling to it.

ROSE: You’re having a wonderful time with the sound of words, aren’t you?

ESTER: Yes, (Laughs) yeah.

ROSE: Also, that’s a very rich area of exploration, indeed, also. There are many sounds that have underlying tones to them that have to do with your very reality creation. So to say that you’re moving to new expression areas is an understatement, for you’re getting to the heart – to say it again – of the matter in allowing yourselves to thrive in ways that you don’t yet do all the time, because you need to allow your inner authority to thrive, indeed. Your heart-sense is a very important associate of that.

The association of self with heart is a very important – as well as somewhat overlooked – aspect that Rose is helping to allow into your sphere, in a sense. For your very early goddesses had this in mind. In her ways, she was the heart-sense of the tribe, she was the very important nurturer, the very breasts were life giving, indeed. So you can allow yourselves to feal her in you now as the supportive, in every way nurturing mother goddess that you need in your days, nurturing you towards health, as well as happiness, indeed. In her ways, she is the grandmother of us all, indeed.

So do so, and do continue to allow yourself to connect in ways that you need to, allowing you to shape her into whatever form you need – in sexual or sensual ways, in ways of daughters or sons, or expressions of fatherhood. All of these have ways of getting to the heart of the goddess spirit, in a sense. So that’s why your wondering about goddesses is a very interesting thing, indeed, for Rose is, indeed, also a goddess, isn’t she? So you’re wanting to express to yourselves the very natures of your goddess heart-selves in ways that you haven’t yet done in your lifetimes, indeed. So do continue to allow your beautiful expressions of heart-sense, and speak up from your hearts this evening, dear ones.

GORDON: I have something to say. Now, I just came in a little bit later, so I don’t know if you’re talking about fears or …

ROSE: Indeed.

PAUL: That’s exactly what started this.

GORDON: Okay, so what I was getting from my spirit guide was to talk about one of the ways of dealing with it in a positive way, because we are using it as a constructive tool. So when you get into realizing what the fear is, you start working with it right away, rather than putting it on the back burner. So this is one of the tools that I’ve been using. If something’s bothering me, I don’t ignore it, I don’t push it to the background, I start dealing with it right away, in the most constructive way that I see fit at that time, which is appropriate. Whether it be speaking, exercising, eating right, or whatever, you start to take action on that as soon as possible.

ROSE: That’s exactly what we mean by allowing yourself to address fears in the immediate way of taking action that you described, indeed, dear one. You have ways of getting to the heart of the matter, indeed, dear Gilbert. So we’ll say a bit more, but you did nail it very well just then. The ways you have of fearing have to do with putting away fears in order to allow yourselves to fear them even more. Then you don’t take action, then you only allow more what?

GORDON: Neurotic behavior.

PAUL: Fear (Group laughter).

ROSE: Exactly, yeah – fears, anxiety, neurotic behavior. In spite of how you want to address your fears, you often don’t, by putting them aside and not dealing with them in the now. So that’s a very excellent way to sort of “pop the bubbles” of fears, because they aren’t, indeed, as big as they may seem in the moment either, are they? Indeed. So do continue the excellent work, dear Gilbert. We want to assure you that your spirit guides are very wonderful authorities, indeed. So do continue your questions if you’d like, dear ones.

PAUL: I have two impressions I want to share before I forget them here. I want to circle back to Christoph’s intent name and my comment about, you know, putting “explorer of how things work,” and then changing that to “fealer of how things work.” And just playing with Christoph’s intent name, I suggested “helper of people,” helper of people to lose their fears. You could also explore that from a fealing, heart-sense perspective, and just explore: what does it feel like if I say a “fealer” of people losing their fears? Fealing … anyway, that’s not quite right, but I wanted to share that (Chuckles) to possibly help Christoph continue with that.

And then to Ester’s wonderful exchange, I got the impression of George Carlin, an American comedian who just passed away in the last month or so, who is the ultimate example, I realize, of the contrary self, of being contrary. And the way I’m starting to define it is as a constructive outcome. So you can be “in your face,” you can be kind of nasty, or really strong like George is in his comedy routine. Sometimes it crosses the line, I think he’s gone too far, and so on. But he is a perfect example of Rose’s contrary self, in my opinion, and Rose can comment on that.

And then the theme of the tests is what George always said: question authority. Question authority. That doesn’t mean to strip it and blow it up and kill it, but to question authority. So I just … it was a beautiful kind of, connecting the dots.

ESTER: Which was great for me when I had the experience, because that has been my path lately, you know, to question authority, to get to that point, you know, I’ve been reading Elias and all this. And to get it once again, this little … how subtle my surrendering authority was. And I hadn’t realized it until I was driving and then, like, “Why I am so worried about the pronunciation?” you know (Laughs)? When, if I just say it this way, I tap into some energy, because saying it that way, I don’t right now. And how important that subtlety was, and how unaware of it I was until that moment.

GORDON: Actually, Rose’s authority too.

ROSE: Exactly.

PAUL: That’s it.

ROSE: That’s why we test you, indeed. That’s why we want to say, “Hey, don’t follow us Roses, follow yourselves,” indeed. That’s why your Guyanas happen, indeed, because people don’t trust themselves – they try to put the authority outside. That’s how you’ve been raised, in many ways.

So try to allow your behaviors to change a bit in regard to authority. This is not incorrect. The authorities you have in your days help you move into new areas of authority. So when someone is challenging you, for example, you can do what? Challenge back, can’t you? You can find ways to distrust them more, and allow yourselves to be trusting yourself in the process.

This is a very geanius way to survive the shift in consciousness. For if the shift is about anything, it’s about trusting self to be your own authorities. It doesn’t matter how you pronounce things exactly. The point to realize is that sometimes you do need to make associations to others. So sometimes there are reasons to pronounce or identify things in certain “correct” ways – we’ll suggest quotes around “correct.” But to say that there is only one way to do anything is not exactly correct either.

So you can truly learn to trust yourselves to be the saviors of yourself, as well as the saviors of others, when you trust your own inner authority to do the job you need to in everyday lives that you have. These are all ways of finding fearlessness. These are all ways of finding truly inspired actions, as well as health and happiness. In every way, your calling is to do what you feal is right in every way. So do so, and continue to ask your glorious questions this evening, dear ones.

GEORGE: Rose, is it true that when a final focus disengages, it is the final focus’s job to face all the belief systems of all the other focuses within the essence? Is that my correct understanding of how it’s going to work?

ROSE: You don’t need to face the beliefs of every focus.

GEORGE: I mean in transition, when the final focus goes into transition.

ROSE: Your essence does, not George.

GEORGE: Okay.

ROSE: So you don’t need to take on the beliefs of every trapper, as well as groundskeeper, in your past, dear George, indeed.

GEORGE: Alright, thank you.

ROSE: Mmhm.

GEORGE: (Humorously) I can sleep well tonight (Group chuckles).

ROSE: We’re talking about certain things in your past that you may want to discover in your focus time now, but to say you need to do this while adjusting your perspective is an understatement. In some ways, the transitional state is about moving into a different, wider perspective also. So when you say you will do such-a-such thing, in some ways the “you” will adjust to accommodate more essence in the perspective, in a sense. Not to say you’re not essence – you are – but to say that your perspective is not as essence-like sometimes is what we’re saying.

GEORGE: Is not as “light”?

ROSE: “Essence-like.” That’s how we describe how Rose is sometimes essence-like more than Joanne, for example, but she is essence. You’re all essence, but we sometimes need to distinguish between your awareness, as well as your growing awareness, as well as Rose’s awareness. This is very subtle, but to say that there is a difference is correct. Okay? So do continue your wonderful comments and questions this evening, dear ones.

Do you have any other fears that you’d like to say you’ll want to love more tonight? Indeed, when your Christoph offered the healing information we provided an intentionality name for, we were also trying to help you realize that the fears need healing, too. For the fears often are discouraged aspects that you can consider splintered off from yourselves. So the “fear healing” is to address aspects of persons who have no real interest in addressing some things they need to.

That’s why, when you think about “Fear Healer,” you have a sense that you’re healing people, right? And the healing happens to the person that is the fear itself. The fear becomes another individual, in some ways. Okay? So that’s why we suggested “Fear Healer.” They are aspects that can be healed that contribute to the necessary health of the individual in question. Okay? So do continue with your wonderful comments and suggestions, dear ones.

NARDINE: If I may make an acknowledgment?

ROSE: Do so, dear Daisy.

NARDINE: For myself again, in recognizing my intent is to love myself and love all others, I have, for many years, again, known and honored my body’s process of expressing always for my highest good, always supporting and helping me, but it expresses my patterns, programs, fears, all blocks of the flow of my essential energy. And so I have learned to trust everything my body expresses for its assistance, because it’s supporting me, and I can recognize with the healing I’m going through. My body continues to express greater wellness, greater alignment, greater bliss.

So I’m just acknowledging and encouraging that whatever our body is doing, we can trust that it’s doing it all for our highest good, and then follow that through, perhaps with more direction into identifying and recognizing the kind of pattern, program, or fear that has been presented in the expression – the way it’s worked for me.

ROSE: That’s exactly right to say this evening. When you are talking about fears, you need to also allow the body to help itself heal itself, for the body has many ways of doing so that you have been trained to believe don’t exist. So the body has miraculous healing ways that can truly help you address your fears. When you, for example, notice the foot issue we talked about earlier, and you notice that you need to move about a bit more, what does your body do? It truly is going to heal itself, because you’ve addressed the fear.

So do continue to realize that the fear is the thing in need of healing most of the time, not the body. The body will heal itself more often than not. Often you will need to realize the very many things like ointments, or prescription drugs, or other really wonderful scientific means. These are all healthy expressions of healing, too. But to say that the body doesn’t know how to assist in these is incorrect. The body is allowing these things to occur so it can thrive. And sometimes you don’t need to realize these alternate means because the body will trust itself to do the work on its own. You only need to address the fears, indeed. So do so, and we’ll continue to allow your questions, and comments, and beautiful expressions of fears, or trusty selves, indeed, this evening, dear ones.

CHRISTOPH: Can I ask another question?

ROSE: Yes.

CHRISTOPH: Okay, my biggest fear now is concerning my dog and some health problems he’s creating. So is this question a bit off topic, or is it okay?

ROSE: That’s a very geanius question, dear one, do continue.

CHRISTOPH: Okay, my dog is nine years old now, and he’s developed an enlarged prostate gland, and there are not much symptoms now, he is only sometimes using drugs, or [inaudible]. The veterinarian says that he needs an operation, otherwise it will get much worse. And the veterinarian said too much testosterone leads to an enlarged prostate gland. As a consequence, his operation consists of taking away his testicles so that he’s not able to produce testosterone anymore. My questions are: why he has created this disease, and is there anything I can do for my dog, or should I trust the veterinarian and let him do the operation?

ROSE: The doggies have many ways of getting your attention also. The doggies have ways of getting your attention now as a wonderful healer, Christoph, so they are in collusion, in some ways, with you, in order to help you, Fear Healer, to do your very wonderful expression of healing for them. You can sense they have more to them than they are showing you. Don’t you also fear they will don their next lives in the process? Don’t you fear they will die, also, dear Christoph? You do very much fear that, correct?

CHRISTOPH: Yes, that’s true.

ROSE: You do. So you need to allow the fear to heal in you first. Okay? Don’t fear death. Fear only the things you can control, then allow yourself to take action to do what you need to do.

In the case of your doggy, he hears your fears in many ways. He allows himself to be able to get to the heart of the matter of your attention also. Your fears are around your manliness also, at times. You don’t need to fear the manliness about yourself. We’re not suggesting you’re any less manly than … (Chuckles) Sylvester Stallone. That’s our view of a very testosterone-providing man, correct?

You’re as manly as him. You have all that he has and more. You have more balance, in some ways, than he does. Allow your balance to healp you – H-E-A-L-P you – to provide him, the doggy, the spiritual healing he needs. For the issue is with your testosterone beliefs, not in him directly. Okay?

CHRISTOPH: Okay.

ROSE: Do so. We’ll also say that you have more masculinity about you than the biggest superhero. Do you know why, dear one? You have many wonderful healing ways of nurturing. The men who need to be in the shifty world ahead, are the ones who need the heart, as well as the mind, as well as the body. Okay? You’re more man than most men already. Do continue to allow your beautiful expressions of healing in ways that bring you the sense of strength, as well as wonderful miracles that you know you have learned to allow now. Okay, dear one?

CHRISTOPH: Okay.

ROSE: Okay. We’ll suggest you’ll do well to give us an update on your doggy next time we speak. We send our very loving energies to help him now, indeed, as well as your delightful family, dear one. Do continue with your questions if you’d like, or we’ll open the floor again.

CHRISTOPH: So you think he would need an operation?

ROSE: Do what you need to do. You’re the healer now, and you’ll do well to trust your own inner authority. Okay, dear one?

CHRISTOPH: Okay.

ROSE; Okay. We will say that you’ll do well to allow your Rose into your thinking also, for you’ll have her in your allowance. The way of spirit for you is very tied to Rose. We suggest you try resting-in-Rose to allow her to teall you how she thinks you might want to go, but you’ll need to do this directly, dear one, for you do have the ability now. Okay?

CHRISTOPH: Okay.

ROSE: Okay. Now we’ll open the floor again for your questions, unless you’d like to do your desserts now. Do you have any other questions this evening, dear ones? Do continue.

NARDINE: Me again, unless someone else has got their hand up (Laughs).

PAUL: No, go ahead.

NARDINE: Boy, this is a new me! (Laughs)

PAUL: You go girl.

NARDINE: (Laughs) I wanted to acknowledge that we healers who – and all of us, that is, on the planet, because we’re all healing in one form or another – but to listen to our hearts, to trust our hearts, to know that our hearts guide us, takes courage and it requires that we be brave in being able to step fully into our own authority, our own governance, our own choosing, knowing that there is never a wrong decision or a wrong choice in the big picture.

And in the moment we get to discern, we get to prefer, we get to identify what matters to us. And in the process, we address our fears just as they come along. But it does require us to be brave, and we are a quiet voice at the moment, but we will get louder and louder. And I just wanted to acknowledge: we are the way-showers, in a fashion. We have a community. We have hands, we can reach out and touch. We have hearts, we can reach out and feal. So let’s be brave together.

ROSE: Exactly. Your every action, indeed, sends ripples throughout the universe. So don’t ever fear that your ways are not the ways you need to do in the world – they are. And you’ll do well to only trust and allow them. We do respond to you also. When you fear the way of spirit, you’ll get the fear at you, in spades, indeed. So the fear will find your ways to be wanting to be expressed also.

For example, when you fear that the way of spirit for you is not to say what you want to say, what happens? You have the sore throat. You have the sense of finding engagements elsewhere. There are many ways that fear will get your attention. So when it does, simply – as your dear Gilbert said – just address to it. Just say, “I know what you are. You’re my friend, fear, and I’m going to listen to you, as well as to address the things you’re trying to get my attention about.” Okay, dear ones?

So do continue to allow your very wonderful expressions, as well as your contrary expressions, to thrive in the world. The world needs you to, indeed, dear ones. Don’t you think Obama wants you to be contrary? Indeed, don’t you think that’s exactly why he decided to go into politics in the first place? He expected to change the world, and he indeed is.

And he’s doing that in very contrary ways. Why not consider how very contrary it was to choose the name “Hussein” as a middle name before birth? Why not consider the many difficulties you have as merely ways of expressing to yourselves the very contrary natures that have ways of getting your attention, as well as many other individuals, indeed? So do so. We’re all Husseins, indeed, aren’t we dear ones?

PAUL: Mmhm.

ROSE: Now we’ll allow your questions for the evening to conclude. You need to begin to allow your Rose selves to penetrate your very natures in ways that you don’t yet. You’re doing the wonderful work in spirit that you need to. You’re learning to allow greater and greater expressions into your days. You’ll want to allow us to include your ways into ours as well. For you don’t even realize how very wonderful you are to us. You inform us, indeed, also. You allow us to thrive in ways you don’t yet understand also.

So do continue to be the beautiful creatures in your world that you need to, as well as trust yourselves to allow the fears, your beautiful expressions, the wonderful ways of contrary selves to thrive in the world, as well as to allow your wonderful selves to move into new areas, indeed. Get shifty, dear ones. You’re going to have many wonderful decades ahead of you now to look forward to, indeed.

We’ll say adieu, and we’ll say also, we’ll see you in your dreams, indeed, dear ones. Goodnight.

PAUL: Thank you, Rose (the rest of the group thanks Rose).

ROSE: You’re very welcome.

(Rose Departs: 7:11 PM.)

(Transcribed by Andrew McCusker.) 

Endnotes:

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[1] Joanne’s note: “Ofay on” is “familiar with” in “Australian,” a variation of the French “au fait.”

[2] Joanne’s note: While this session was being transcribed, I heard the Rush song, Closer to the Heart, which beautifully articulates what was discussed: “And the men who hold high places must be the ones who start, to mold the new reality closer to the heart…”

[3] Joanne’s note: One day, I was beating myself up about doing something at work that didn’t go as I would have liked, and I felt dumb. I talked to Rose about it, and she said that even she is a “dim bulb” sometimes, as even she doesn’t know everything. It was the most comforting thing she could have said, and so moving. It’s one of the highlights of my relationship with her so far, and often comes to mind when I need it.

[4] Joanne’s note: Rose is referring to McCain referring to Obama condescendingly as “that one” during a televised presidential debate.

[5] Joanne’s note: Rose defines evil the same way Elias does, “lacking compassion.”