“Contrariness is Essence in Its Glory”
“All Things are Possible in Essence”
“Ego and Essence Are Truly Partners in Spirit”
“Descending Energies are Important Too”
“Is There a Super Ego in Charge?”
“Essences are Cagey to Inspire, not Intrude”
Session 269 (Group/Dinner & A Dead Gal)
Saturday, July 19, 2008
Participants: Joanne (Tyl), Paul (Caroll), Bob, Caryn, Mike, Kat, Joyce (Rosalie), George, Ursula, Tom, Eric, Frieda, Will, and Rumi the cat.
(Paul’s note: Three participants were helping us test out our conference phone: Eric (Kenala) in Pennsylvania, Frieda (Brenda) in Pennsylvania, and Will in San Jose.)
(Rose arrives 4:38 PM. Arrival time 30 seconds.)
ROSE: Team Rose has a very interesting way to…. (Sound of a dog barking, Joanne chuckles.)
PAUL: Excuse me, Eric can you mute your phone? If you press *6 you will mute your phone. Thank you.
ERIC: Yeah.
ROSE: Tell Kimba Rose says, “Hello,” dear one.
ERIC: I think she’s saying hello to you!
ROSE: (Joanne laughs) Exactly. She knows us very well. She is an animal, as well as a very geanius[1] friend of yours, dear one.
Continuing: The way you have of getting your attention is sometimes very interesting. The weany girl has a bit of stomach trouble this evening.[2] (Humorously) Her way is to say to herself to allow the contrary information to flow both ways at times. So you, as well, have some things that you do for your attention-getting as loving ways to allow your essence into your wonderful days. So try to imagine that everything that occurs in your life is essence saying to you, “We do love you, and we do want to love you more,” but you need to say to yourselves, at times, what you need to do in order for that to occur. We always do love you, but sometimes you don’t feal[3] us in you.
So try to imagine that every wonderfully contrary thing that goes incredibly wrong, at times, is always essence trying to get your attention. So, contrary selves, as essence, do this.[4] So when you feal that you’re wanting essence into your very wonderful plans, you can expect that the contrary self will be there at times to really mess things up royally. And when she does – we will call her the “bitch-self,” that is your contrary self – she will, in every way, “don’t” things. “Don’t do this, don’t do that,” in order to get your attention to become most discerning of your plans. For sometimes the plans are the things you need to change only, not yourself. Your plans are getting in your ways at times – the plans that don’t include your way of spirit. For you do want to allow the way for yourselves to realize the best selves you can possibly imagine.
So your contrary self is there to lovingly get in your way of your plans. So watch out, for the contrary self loves to mess things up so badly that you’ll discover new things that you never did before, in the most beautifully messy way possible. (Humorously, referring to Jo’s upset tummy) To say this another way: shit happens.
So try to imagine that the contrary self works in mysterious ways, indeed – sometimes smelly ways, too. So try to find the wondrous existence that awaits you, as well as the best revision of acceptance. For you need to allow both your perfectly wondrous selves, as well as your perfectly contrary selves, too. So do so, and we’ll assist as always.
Now we’ll also take some questions tonight, dear ones. Any wonderful questions regarding the contrary self first? (Pause)
PAUL: (Humorously) Okay, session’s over; no questions.
GEORGE: Okay, let’s go eat!
TOM: Is the contrary self part of our linear being, or is it part of our essence, or a combination of both? And how do we tell if something’s being created by ourselves versus a message, if you would, from essence?
ROSE: That is a very geanius question, dear one, for you have sontered Rose, in some ways, already. So you do know the question has some depth to it already. You do want to say more about that, don’t you, dear one? For you do get Rose more than you say that you do, possibly? Do you know that answer, dear one?
TOM: I don’t believe that I do know that answer…
ROSE: Okay.
TOM: …consciously.
ROSE: (Joanne chuckles) That’s good. We’ll say you do know the answer, but you don’t want to allow the question to be raised. You know what we mean, perhaps. The question that is raised is – who are you? – indeed. So when you say you chreate[5] the reality that you do, you often take out the ego-self in the process, or sometimes only focus on the ego-self. And when you try to allow the ego-self in to say, “Here I am creating my reality,” at times you don’t allow essence to be in your contrary definition that you have of who the creators really are.
So to say that the essence comes in to you to assist is not exactly correct, because you are essence. So you need to expand the question to be something along the lines of, “What is the contrary self in essence?” To say this [another] way is to say that, “You are essence, too.”
So to say, “You are essence, the contrary self is you,” you would be correct, [as you would] to say also that, “The contrary self is essence in the most beneficial way.” For you have stripped essence of any fealings of adversity, in a sense. You have a sort of perfection belief system when it comes to essence.
This is why Rose wants to share the contrary self information with you, so you don’t have the worst to learn about essence as you go. You need to realize that contrariness is essence in its glory, even when you don’t feal that it is a geanius way to be: it is. You have many beliefs about essence that will be dispelled, in many ways, in sorting out the contrary selves’ ways in your lives.
So try to imagine the best of essence as being in the worst actions that essence may take sometimes. We don’t mean worst in the way that you might think of as worst, for violation is not the way of spirit. We mean worst in the sense of fucking up your plans royally.
So try to imagine that essence does want to say, “Hell, we won’t go there.” Or, “Hell, we will go there to show you how you are.” And we will also say, “What do you want to do that for? You don’t need to do that at all.” So you’ll find that essence will say to you – ego – many things, but the ego is also essence as well. So this is a very complex arrangement that you’ve chreated in your essence. To say you are – but your “only” ego-self is not – essence, is incorrect.
So you really need to say you’re wonderful in every way, even when you are merely speaking of ego. And the contrary self works with your ego and with your essence self that includes ego in ways that are truly essence-ish. So try to imagine the devilish-angelic source that you call essence as being in you, as well as assisting you in every way. Okay?
TOM: Thank you.
ROSE: Don’t worry. We were testing you already, dear one. We do test you. To say that you’re wanting tests in an understatement, for you have agreed to Rose testing you in ways that you need her to. Okay?
We’ll take another question if you’d like, dear ones.
GEORGE: May I? I want to see if I can phrase this the way I’m thinking it. Since you talk about essence, we were talking about intent last week. How much does essence get involved in one’s own creation of reality within one’s intent?
For instance, I read this wonderful thing by Elias who said, “My friend, the impossible is possible.” Yet, if a focus has a certain intent, is essence always going to make sure that focus is going to stay pursuing that intent, regardless of what that focus will try to create on its own? Will essence trick him on purpose, or help him on purpose as long as it has to do with intent? Or does one truly have the freedom to create one’s reality?
Because what I’m thinking is look, everybody says, “Well, I’m going to win the lottery.” I can almost bet that if that is not your intent, that essence will help you spend it very quickly, and get back (Laughs) on your own course, right? So how much freedom do we actually have creating our own reality within this intent guideline? And how much is essence going to whip you into shape, or you know, fuck with you, like you just said.
ROSE: Kick your ass?
GEORGE: Yeah.
ROSE: Yes, indeed. It does at times, but you are correct that essence wants to sort you out, in a sense. You need sorting out sometimes. For example, your example that the lottery winner would not have much money to spend in time is the geanius way that essence does get on your case – to sort you out. So the contrary self will say, “Hey, you can say all you want to about essence, but we know better. You should spend your money on cars, as well as homes you can’t really afford.”
We do know well that scenario, because you do this every day. You try to allow essence into your homes, but you don’t need to say more to them after that. You say, “Well you have the home now.” So try to imagine that you don’t need the home anymore. What do you do? You lose the home if you are not on your way of spirit. You need to say that you don’t need the home anymore sometimes.
That’s why the contrary self tells you to lose the home. So you can say that you don’t need the home, but you do. So you rationalize things, saying that you have bad luck, or you don’t know how to manage your finances. But in reality, that’s you listening at times to your contrary self, saying to, “Look away from your current plans and allow us to really mess things up to get you on your way of spirit.”
Now in this, you have full control of the tuning mechanisms, but you don’t have full control over the sense of program. So you can tweak the controls, but you can’t change the channel, in a sense. That’s why you are human. So you have – contrary to your beliefs – some constraints that you have decided upon as essence. To say this another way, you have ways of getting into your “game of life” that have to do with the rules of engagement that you can’t change really. But your essence does have this in mind when you decided to realize physical reality. Okay?
So don’t worry that the essence self is holding you back. She is not. She wants your contentment, as well as your happiness. So when you fully get this, you can realize more happiness in your days, even the days you don’t find beautiful, because you have some degree of expectation that is not fully realized. So your contrary self will say, as well, that you have more to you than you can imagine.
So when you’re in the dumps, sontering[6] essence saying, “Why do you do this to me?” Your contrary self says, “We love you, that’s why.” And you’ll do well to also remember that the contrary self loves you, now and forever, no matter what you say about yourself, no matter what you feal about yourself. The contrary self says, “You don’t need to do anything. We want you to realize how very loved you are, in spite of the plans you think you need to take care of.”
So we’re not saying to not make plans. We are saying that you need to allow more contrariness into your days, so as to sort yourselves out a bit. That’s all.
So do you have any additional questions, dear one?
GEORGE: Well, unless you answered it, I don’t get it. That makes me understand that somehow our so-called freedom to create our own reality is limited.
ROSE: Who do you mean when you say “you”?
GEORGE: The focus.
ROSE: That’s correct.
GEORGE: That’s what I was trying to….
ROSE: You as essence do not have any realization of limitations.
GEORGE: But as a focus you have to.
ROSE: You don’t have to. You want to as essence. Okay? That’s very different. You’re wanting ego to call the shots is not the way of life. The way of life is essence calling the shots, but you’re correct that your ego is a very important part of that. Okay, dear one?
GEORGE: (Sarcastically) Excellent. Thanks Rose for confusing me even more. (Laughter)
ROSE: You’re very welcome!
PAUL: So let me ask you about free will then, of the ego.
ROSE: The ego has free… we will wait. (Pause as Paul wrangles Rumi who is trying to eat human food).
The ego, weany boy, has free will within some critical areas. We will say that sometimes the free will isn’t as free as you might think, but it is free in every way within some actions that will be allowed by essence. Your wanting ego to have free will means that ego would be essence acting in ways that are afforded, in many ways, only to essence, as well as to other deities we do not realize yet.
Essence is not the final frontier, in a sense, as far as we can tell. So we imagine only that there are other deities that would have free will in addition to essence. But ego does have it, in many spiritual ways, as well as physical ways. For ego can also say to essence, you want to say to them, what you’re wanting to do next. You can find ways to lobby essence to do what your ego wants to do. We will not necessarily think this best for you, but we will imagine you into other areas that you may want to go. So there is always a give and take in every way possible.
By saying to essence that you want something different, you have more things in store for you in essence, but not exactly in ego form. You exist in many dimensions, as well as other life-“times”. So to say that your ego wants things, isn’t necessarily what ego wants, but what ego wants for essence, if you understand that, dear one.
PAUL: So let me just comment on that. I do have a sense of that from my integral perspective. When I conceptualize free will, I think of it as holonic free will, meaning that it’s relative to all these nested relationships that any particular holon[7] finds itself in.
For example, in physical terms, we have air molecules, nebula star dust made of physical molecules – hydrogen, sodium, oxygen, and so on. Those molecules have their own free will within the limits of what their capacity is as consciousness in physical form. Then when we get into a big evolutionary leap in the formation of planets, biospheres – planetary systems – we now have sexually reproducing cellular life forms.
So to the human being, my liver cell has its own free will to do what a liver cell will do. It lives and it dies, and it serves its purpose within my physical body. A lung cell, a brain cell, a neuron, a heart cell, will come and go and has its own free will in the moment. And so my heart, then, made up of all those heart cells, or my brain, thinking of that as a holon made up of all these other relationships, has its own free will within its limits.
And then we come to the focus. It has free will, too. The ego makes choices and does think. But my thoughts don’t create reality, because if they did, the world would be at peace, and everyone would be happy and bored to tears, because no one would be sad and there would be no pain and suffering.
So within the focus traditionally, in philosophy, free will is dealt with sort of as a black and white thing. It’s just all or nothing free will. But that’s from the human perspective. Is it predetermined or is there freedom? And we believe that there’s amazing freedom, even at the ego level, with egoic choice, and wants, and desires to do.
But there are limits, too. The example I like to use is, how many people actually choose their moment of death egoically? A very, very miniscule number. And these are typically spiritually realized human beings who participate consciously in the moment of their death. Or people that close from a terminal illness, they know they’ve given into that and they participate and they go with that, too. But how many egos then say, “Today’s the day,” you know? And it’s a beautiful day and they come and they go.
Essence is involved in that, right, and so up to the essence layer, and what’s happening there, it has free will and as Rose just mentioned that there may be other deities, or further inward – more Source oriented Aspects of Consciousness – that have their own nested type of free will. It’s all nested together.
So that was just sort of a (Laughs) commentary. What do you think of that, Rose?
ROSE: Team Rose says that is exactly right, dear weany boy. (Paul laughs) You have more in you than you can possibly imagine. Realize that even Rose doesn’t know everything. She has more to her than she knows, as well as she has some structure about her.
Now, we are a very wide essence, comprised of many essences. So when you say that Rose has constraints, you’re talking about many constraints, as well as few constraints, in some respects.
The constraints are the ones that the consciousness allows, for every bit of consciousness – from liver cells to entities we do know beyond ours – have the constraints they agree to. And we will say that your ego has some, too.
Do you agree that the ego needs boundaries, or do you feal that the ego has more to it than it is being allowed to express?
Now we want to say this to dear Dr. Phil[8] at times, too, (Eric Laughs) for he practices things that you would find appealing, and he says “your ego has no bounds” to some individuals. And why do you think he does this? He means to show individuals that they have to realize they are in some constraints in life. So he is being a geanius nun[9] in doing this, for he needs to realize that individuals do need to be told there are boundaries to things.
So to say to an individual who is abusing drugs, for example, that they have an ego that is out of touch with reality, is to say there are some things that your ego can handle, but sometimes you need to give up in order to allow essence in to help you. So to say to someone, “Your ego is boundless” is not true, but to say that “Your ego is part of essence that is boundless” is true.
So to say this another way: your ego is very beautiful. We do not have the same take on ego that many individuals do – that the ego is bad and you have to suppress it. This is so very untrue that we want to cry, because the ego is exceptionally geanius in the way it has of finding value in what it has learned so far. But the ego only goes on what it has allowed itself to learn, then it becomes somewhat limited in its ability to assist you.
That’s where essence has to come into play. Essence says, “You know, you’re better than just your ego. You’re essence, dear one, and we want to help you to be the best individual you can be, but you need to allow yourselves to beautifully provide your ego the assurance that we will not harm you.” For the ego doesn’t know about essence so much that it does have this sense that it is wrong to not fear things that it doesn’t know.
So your ego says, “I don’t know this thing called essence.” So we will say that, “This is incorrect.” The ego needs to say, “The essence is my friend, and I trust my friend to do what it needs to do for the way of spirit, for the beautiful individual that I want to be and I am.”
So to say to ego, “Trust us, we know what we’re doing” is sometimes the best way to assure the ego that you have his best interests in mind also, for he will learn things, and he will expand to accommodate the many things that essence has to show him.
So trust that we know all about egos, and we have more than enough experience with egos to know how to speak with egos. So try to trust ego to learn from essence how he can trust himself to be the best self he can be.
Now we will say also, the ego has more to him than is necessary, at times. Ego fears, too. Ego says, “I fear because you need to fear the things you don’t know.” The fear is only in your ego, not in essence. So when you fear, trust that ego is only being what ego is – a fearful one for telling you how to live. Ego is never wrong in fearing things. You know that fear only goes so far, though. And you fear less when you realize that fear is only to move you into areas you haven’t been before, perhaps, or you need to go again.
So when you fear, only trust the ego to fear more when you say that you will not move into new areas. For ego will say, “Move now,” and when you don’t, the ego will fear the fear that you didn’t take care of in the first place. Do you understand what we’re saying here?
The anxiety that ego feals when you don’t use fear to move into new areas is why the ego gets so very limited at times. He fears things, then you don’t take his word for the need for movement, then you often move into more fearful areas by not addressing to the fear you had when you started the exercise. So trust that fear is there for geanius reasons – to move you into new areas of exploration – and allow ego to fear only in ways that are productive. Okay?
Now, we did go on for a bit, but did you realize the answer to your question, dear one?
PAUL: Yeah, a long time ago.
ROSE: Okay.
PAUL: Thank you.
ROSE: And you, dear George?
GEORGE: Well, to me personally, it confirms my suspicion that you create your own reality within a certain set of rules that you agree to. It’s not so much, obviously, going back to my original question – sorry to beat a dead dog here – but it looks like this whole intent on value fulfillment, it looks like you’d be allowed to create your reality as long as you are aligning with your intent and at the same time fulfilling your value.
That’s the vibe I get. (Laughs) That’s the way I feel it. That’s the way I see it. And I just wanted to say that you kind of confirmed that in my understanding.
PAUL: And I’ll just throw in there’s no create without co-create, no creation without co-creation. It’s simultaneously nested creation and co-creation.
GEORGE: What started me was that wonderful phrase that gives many people, including me, hope saying that “the impossible is possible.” But obviously we all have certain possibilities and impossibilities. So your possible might be my impossible or vice versa. So it looks like somehow there is a certain setup going on. I don’t think it’s as free as it’s being presented. It looks like there’s other layers that you have to abide by. (Laughs)
PAUL: Well, it is and it isn’t. I mean, sure, we can all theoretically walk through walls, right? And violate the strong or weak nuclear force, but I don’t know how to do it. (Laughs)
GEORGE: Well, I’m not debating that. I was just thinking out loud, but you know…
PAUL: Or manifest a turkey out of thin air.
GEORGE: …maybe another will come out of this.
ERIC: (Humorously) Just an apple would be good.
PAUL: Yeah, okay an apple. Or how about some gold? (George laughs) You can’t eat that, can you?
GEORGE: (Chuckling) Or a chair.
ROSE: You do that all the time – you just don’t do it as ego, that’s all. That’s only the way you have of explaining things – by ego.
GEORGE: Ego means focus, is that what she means?
PAUL: Yeah.
CARYN: You’re consciously aware of it?
ROSE: You’re consciously aware, but you don’t give yourself credit for the wonderful things you chreate every day. Your ego says, “I’m not creating an apple, so I must not be doing this correctly.” But your ego is doing things correctly, only the ego doesn’t call the shots all the time. Sometimes it does, but not always. Essence always does.
So ego only gets in the way when you get into areas that are finding displeasure because you’re not creating well enough. You’re always creating well enough. You just don’t always know this, ego-wise. So when you say, “Impossible things are possible,” that’s exactly correct, but not always in your [ego’s] terms, George, but in your essence’s terms, always. Okay?
Now we’ll take more questions if you’d like, dear ones.
PAUL: I want to throw out one more thing while we’re on this topic. Eckhart Tolle is all the rage on Oprah and it’s a big pop phenomenon with his Power of Now series with his other book Awakening to a New Earth. And what strikes me as being somewhat different from at least the conscious creation teachings we study is this railing on ego that Eckhart does to the….
ERIC: You know I had the same response reading a bit, that it’s down on ego. Ego is an integral part!
PAUL: Heavily, heavily down on ego and…
ERIC: Heavily down, bad…
PAUL: …saying that it’s pathological – all ego is pathological.[10]
ERIC: Yeah, I got the same….
PAUL: To me, Eric, this is a sinful self hangover[11] from the…
ERIC: I understand, I agree.
PAUL: …religious worldview that has infected…
ERIC: Religious, yes, a religious type of thing.
PAUL: …Eckhart’s teaching. But, he carefully defines it, and if we were to have a discussion with him I think we’d come to a middle ground where we’re really not being that different, because the bottom line is what I want to get to. What’s he’s intending – let’s take that surface level disagreement and put that over here for a second – and where’s he going with the teaching?
ERIC: Right.
PAUL: Because we all agree with it. His focus is, if you get beyond ego – now I don’t know what that is; my Paulness is ego and anything I know is Paul, is ego. So to get beyond Paul and to know myself as George, perhaps, okay there’s a transcendent moment. Or to feel connected to everything in that nondual oneness, that’s a beautiful thing, too. And that creates and co-creates with us, and to identify with that and as that as I know where Eckhart is pushing that. And it’s more of the traditional teachings, but it’s kind of getting confused with New Age, you know, pop psychology in Eckhart’s case.
He’s not a schooled psychiatrist or metaphysician, and yet he’s had very powerful realization in altered states and so he knows from what he speaks. And yet to consider all ego as pathology as he has in his new book, it shocked me to read it – it’s difficult to read those sections. There’s other parts of the book that are quite beautiful, though, so it’s a “true but partial” thing.
So I’m just throwing that out there to this overall discussion, you know, how do we create our reality? What’s free will? What’s creating? What’s one hundred percent causal? There’s no set answer to this in terms of one hundred percent; you know, ego ninety-seven percent? (Laughs) In physical terms? Ninety-nine point nine? But it’s still not one hundred. But it’s right on up there with its choice, you know, that’s Elias’ big thing, is what are you choosing and doing? It’s the ego, or objective awareness, as he calls it. So, I’m just….
FRIEDA: Paul, why do we feel that we must have the answers to everything?
PAUL: Why, George, do we feel that we must…
GEORGE: I only have answers to my personal questions that I think about.
FRIEDA: It’s like an impossible quest.
GEORGE: But let me say something else…
ERIC: One worth pursuing.
GEORGE: …if I would have never read his material, I would have never had these questions. So this is what led me to it – so it’s all of the same pot, pretty much. We just have different perspectives, I guess.
FRIEDA: Mmhm.
PAUL: George is a seeker and he seeks truth with a capital “T” and a little “t,” and (Humorously) yellow cabs in Santa Monica, and other stuff that you’ll read about in sessions that are coming out soon, in the past.
So, you know, that’s my mom who asked that question, and it’s a good question, because what’s the intellect going to solve ultimately? It’s a tool and it helps us with the map.
GEORGE: But the thing is that the way it works for me, I’ve got to feel it. If it feels right, I have to pursue it, right? But somehow I have to understand for, my own self, kind of the mechanics, because you have to kind of be aware of yourself throughout the day, and you say, “Okay, well, this feeling, this, and this, and that.” So that’s why the intellect, somehow, it’s a tool that one has to use to gather more knowledge, because every single day it’s another step, and then you get more information, and then that explains something that you may have read two years ago.
That is the way things work for me, at least. So if somebody asks a question about something else, I can relate to it, also. So I don’t think we’re that different. I think that the only thing that separates us is our own beliefs, and the way we’re raised, and our life, and all this other stuff.
BOB: Conditioning, I think is a big part of it, how we’re conditioned – beliefs, right?
GEORGE: Everything is… they condition you since you’re born, you know, the school conditions you…
BOB: What’s a belief? You can…
GEORGE: …the family and….
BOB: …change beliefs all the time.
GEORGE: Yeah.
ROSE: There is a lot of discussion about beliefs in the fearful ways of Eckhart Tolle. The fears are, as you said, dear one, the sinful self taking control. That is very true, that Eckhart does have these beliefs in him, as well as many individuals who follow the more stringent practices that are about ascendence, but not to the full realization that you need regarding transcendence, because ascendence is only half the story – descendence is the other half.
You have more to you than only transcendence. What about transdescendence? What about truly being in your world in ways that stoke you in every way? Why not enjoy the riches that ego has to tell you about? The ego says, “I want that.” The ego says, “I must take that.” The ego says, “Try to do this, try to do that.” So you can say that the ego has your best interests in mind all the time. It’s only that the ego takes some talking to at times, that’s all.
So when your ego gets full of itself thinking it’s the only thing, get real with the ego by assuring it that it’s not alone, and that it needs the essence self to contradict it at times, even, as well as to share information that it may not avail itself of. So your ego needs essence to assure it that it’s beautiful, as well as finding of value for you. That is a very geanius thing.
So trust the ego, but not too much, that’s all. (Frieda laughs) And when you feal that you need to find ways to balance the ego, try to remember that you’re in the world for a very geanius reason, and the ego needs to sometimes find that reason in order to feal better about itself. And when it does, you’ll get the best that ego and essence have to offer you. For they are truly the partners you need in spirit – we do mean spirit. Ego is spirit, too, not something to be transcended. It is truly spiritual to have an ego, but it has limitations, that’s all.
So try to imagine that in your days, the ego and essence, hand-in-hand, try their best to make you very, very happy indeed. Okay? Sonter essence to tell you how to do that, and we’ll say only this: the ego is in every way holy, too – wholly you in every way, in your very limited way. Ego is holy. Okay? Not to be distrusted all the time, and not to be demonized. So take that to your Eckhart Tolle and tell him Rose said so, indeed. (Laughter)
Now, we’ll say more about that at another time, and we’ll suggest you take a break for now, and we’ll come back later to answer more questions, dear ones. Okay?
PAUL: Thank you Rose.
ERIC: Thank you Rose.
FRIEDA: Thank you Rose. Best regards from the East Coast, dear.
ROSE: Thank you, dear Brenda.
BREAK: 5:35 PM.
RESUME: 6:05 PM.
(Will joins via phone from San Jose.)
ROSE: To continue the discussion on ego, we will ask you a question, dear ones, “What do your egos have to say about essence?”
We are saying directly to ego selves now. What do your egos have to say about essence?
Go ahead, ego selves. Talk now, dear ones.
MIKE: My ego is obsessed with transdescendence.
JOANNE: With trance descendance?
PAUL: Trans.
MIKE: I want to bring all of essence down here into this focus.
PAUL: Did you hear that, Will?
WILL: Not totally.
PAUL: Okay.
ROSE: Do you wish to repeat that, dear one?
MIKE: My ego self is obsessed with transdescendence. I want to bring essence into ego, or into focus, rather than trying to get out of here or go anyplace else.
ROSE: Exactly. You want to allow ego self to incur the Wrath, in some ways, of the Earth. You want to allow earth-sense into your ego self, as well as into your essence self. That is the definition, in some respects, of ego self, too. To say this another way: your ego needs the Wrath of the Earth.
Now, we’ll explain, because we don’t mean wrath in the same way you might consider wrath to be. The wrath we mean is Wrath with a capital “W,” Wrath in the sense that Wrath is sometimes geaniously providing guidance from essence: “Wrath” in the sense of The Grapes of Wrath.[12]
The Grapes of Wrath have more to do with essence than you can imagine, perhaps. The Grapes of Wrath are the way your essence talks to you in earthly terms. So Wrath can mean fire and brimstone, as well as fearful things like tornados, assuming that tornados are deemed wrathful – they are. But the exciting world of tornados is not to punish you. It is to get your attention only.
So earthquakes, tornados, sometimes fires, too, have Wrath in them, not to say that they are punishments. This is an incorrect use of the term. We mean Wrath in a dramatic sense only. Wrath is also wheat growing, and pineapples growing, as well as bananas being tended in the fields.[13] This is Wrath.
This is why you want to connect to your essence self: to tell you how the world wants to show you her Wrath in every way, for Wrath also means bounty. So try to imagine yourselves in Wrathful Bliss with essence when you allow transdescendence.
Sontering self can be considered ego when you realize that ego wants to pull up into itself the beautiful boundaries as well, for boundaries have their ways of finding you to best be yourselves. Boundaries have needs to tell you things that you don’t feal sometimes. So boundaries can be the weather that gets in your way of going to town, or has some things to show you about yourselves like hail. Perhaps you need to stay home that day. What do you do?
You have a sense that the weather has forgiveness sometimes, but mostly you wrathfully show the weather what you think of it, as well as how you think it gets in your way. But when you transdescend the weather, you incorporate the beauty that the poetry of the Earth has to share with you, and you get more from your day indeed when you do, for why go your way in your days without the allowance of the Earth’s messages, dear ones?
For you do want that now, don’t you? You do want to feal part of the Earth. And this is how you can say to your ego, “You’re correct to make the weather be what it is today.” (Music starts playing in the background as Will is disconnected from the conference call) For you can find more in your ego self when you pay attention to your ascending energies from the Earth, indeed.
PAUL: Rose, I’m sorry, can I interrupt you just briefly? (Paul attempts to reconnect with Will via the conference call)
ROSE: Yes. We want to say that was a good song to listen to.[14] (Paul laughs) We like that song very much. It’s about essence telling you you’re beautiful, dear ones.
PAUL: That was an interesting… (Paul connects to conference call, and waits for Will who reconnects a minute later.)
Alright. Sorry about that.
ROSE: Okay, we’ll continue now. We were saying that ego wants the Earth to speak to it, and when it allows this, it has more to say also in your way of spirit. For ego has the sense that the ascending energy of the Earth to ego does inform it, and ego can descend into Earth energy. That’s why you’re wanting to say that, from ego, it loves this, indeed. When it allows Earth energy into its days, it wants to assure you only that it is in charge, in some ways, but it also has a sense that the energy is informing it in ways that will help it to fear not, when the ego gets in line with the Earth energy.
So ego has ways of getting the spirit of the Earth when it allows that. You have also learned to distrust the Earth, but ego doesn’t do this on its own. These are beliefs speaking now, and if you realize that ego wants the information, it will be a happier ego, indeed. So try to allow the transcendent energy of the Earth to supply the ego with the assurances that the ego is, of course, in charge of the weather at times, for it is, in some ways, in charge. It does know what the hell it is about, at times, when you allow it to. Okay?
So trust that ego does want transascendence as well as transdescendence, for transdescendence has features that are good, also. Try to imagine that ego has to get the information from the Earth at times, and she’ll do well to incorporate that into her ignoring of other things like essence at times. She can get essence, in a sense, by listening to Earth energy. Do you follow?
We’re being a bit unclear, perhaps, because ego has a sort of back and forth realization of Earth energy in that the Earth has properties that ego learns from, but also ego must learn them, and ego doesn’t always want to do that. Okay?
So trust that ego will find value in Earth lessons, indeed. Trust that ego has more to say to us this evening too, dear ones. Any other egos want to suggest some ways that ego has to get the essence off its back, perhaps?
Essence does get the ego to get into things that ego doesn’t want to do. What are those things, dear ones? Things that you have dear to you, perhaps. What are they? What things do you want to do that your egos say, “Don’t do that”?
BOB: You mean meditation, maybe?
ROSE: That’s a very good one, dear one. That’s a geanius answer, because it is very true that ego says, “What do we need that for?” And ego will be correct: ego doesn’t need meditation, but ego isn’t the entirety of you, and ego will rebel and say, “We have much better, more valuable things to do than meditate,” indeed.
So trust that this is ego pushing back, but essence wants you to meditate, indeed. It is [perhaps] the only way towards spirit, in a sense. Mediation has many ways to do itself, and it’s true that it does do itself, for when you feal like meditating, it will happen on its own. You’ll get a sense that you’re in complete connection with essence, and you’ll want to do it again and again. But ego will tell you not to, because you need to do things that make money, or realize pining for things, or realize that you need to make phone calls.
So try to imagine ego having less to say about the things that call to you in your way of spirit, and you’ll discover that it will have much more to do with getting in your way at times then in finding things that are valuable for you, dear ones. Okay?
What else would you do if ego would get out of your way, dear ones? You would do the things you find blissful perhaps, wouldn’t you? When you fear less, you’ll do more in your way of spirit at times, correct?
PAUL: Mmhm.
ROSE: Won’t you, indeed? And ego says: “Don’t do that. That’s weird. That’s so weird we can’t tell you how the many people in your lives will make fun of you if you do that.”
You would say to ego, then: “Why do you care? Why do you care what we do, for you’re only looking at a certain part of the picture? If individuals want to laugh at me, why not let them? Are you so very scared and small that you’d really care that much if they do?”
Realize we’re not suggesting that you want to be made fun of, only that ego will have the very weirdest reasons for wanting you to not be happy; and they are weird in the sense that they are the things that you found weird when you were eleven years old and wanted to do something that your friends did not, and weird in the sense that if you were truly following your way of spirit, you would not care in the least.
So trust that ego self is often a very adolescent self that incurs the Wrath of essence when it steps out of line. For example, the ego self will say, “What do you want to do that for?”
The essence self will say, “To follow your way of spirit.”
Ego self will say, “Why do that? We are very capable of doing that on our own.”
And the essence self will say, “How’s that?”
And the ego self will say, “We help her do what she wants to do.”
And the essence self will say, “Aha! That’s not what essence wants, though.”
You’re correct that ego will only feal in charge when it has only your old self to blame for your unhappiness. For your old self wants things that your new self doesn’t, and you can think of essence as your new self. Okay?
So think of ego self as your dear old friend who doesn’t want you to change one bit, because she likes you that way – eleven years old, and so on – and your essence self has more to give you, in a sense, in regard to your future.
So try to imagine that ego and essence do the best they can for you, only you need to know who to listen to at any given time. Okay, dear ones?
Now, do you have any more ego friends to talk to us tonight?
Okay, we’ll say to them, then, “Ego selves, we do love you. We want only your very best selves to blossom. So try to not fear so completely. You can fear some, and we appreciate that, but we don’t want you to fear always. And when you do, realize that we have more to tell you about yourself than you could possible imagine.
“And when you try to grow up a bit and expand to include the many facets that you truly will become in time, you’ll be a beautiful ego, more than you are now, and you’ll incorporate the many beautiful things that we have, for you, in store.”
So try to imagine that ego self trying to interest itself in the many sparkling things that await it. Okay, dear ones? So do so, and we’ll suggest you want to ask questions now. Okay?
WILL: I have a question, Rose. Do the choices that the ego makes – that the individual makes – have an effect on essence? So to the extent that an ego chooses intent, or to live out the intentions, or live in alignment with essence, does it affect essence?
ROSE: You’re asking a very geanius question, dear one. We will say that you’re correct that ego does inform essence very much. In fact, every day essence looks into ego, in some ways, to inform essence.
This is hugely important to say, because ego does have many gifts to share in every way. So ego has much to say to essence to inform it in ways that are truly inculcated into everything there is. So you’re correct that ego does this, but we’ll only point out a small difference in what you said: Ego did not choose to become self in physical form – essence did. Ego had something to do, in some ways, with this, but essence had the main decision involved in the action.
So ego does want to be here as an essential aspect of essence, but ego does not take the reins, in a sense, as essence does. He does sometimes in certain parameters, as we were saying earlier, but essence does control an ego, sometimes beats the band in regard to decisions. So he does do that, but essence is always in charge, in a sense.
Now the ego does inform essence, and he does inform All in many respects. So that’s a very big role to have. Ego isn’t just limited to self, in that respect. So you’re correct that ego does inform essence, informs All, and ego is connected to All in that respect, and does influence All in that respect, yes, dear one.
WILL: Thank you.
ROSE: You’re very welcome. Now do you have any other questions for your Roses, dear Will?
WILL: Yeah, it’s a similar question. Maybe the looking at – I’m thinking of Paul’s article that he wrote in NewWorldView about how ultimately there’s no separations in the self[15] – so looking at it from that standpoint of no separation, let’s say the self at the level of myself interfacing with the world all the way up to, you know, essence, and then multiple focuses, and you know you can go through the different levels up to the highest level.
I guess what we’ve been talking about is the influence of essence on the self, so if the self becomes more – the smaller “s” self – becomes more aware of essence, its life is enriched, its awareness is growing, and that’s what’s happening here. What I was trying to say then: what’s the counterpart of that on the side of essence, essence in the biggest sense?
So is the influence a two way street? I know that essence created the self, the self doesn’t create essence, but still, I’m interested in the impact of the decisions made at smallest level of self on the largest aspects of essence. For example, yourself Rose, what would the impact be on you, if that makes sense? Some decisions made in smaller places.
ROSE: That’s a somewhat difficult question to answer, because the way spirit has is in all things, so even the flight of the bumblebee has to do with essence.
WILL: Yes.
ROSE: Okay, so essence has more to this than you can possibly imagine. But that said, ego has more to this, too, because ego has a bigger say than the bumblebee does, but not the same as Rose does, because Rose is wider.
WILL: Yes.
ROSE: But that is also untrue, in some ways, because on some levels – we don’t want to say, “levels,” but there’s no real way to get around this – on some levels, bumblebees have ultimate sway, okay? So egos do, too, and egos have sway in ways that are beautifully creating of your realities, which are very important to you, and not to bumblebees. Okay?
So to put the package together: you’re correct that egos do have much sway in realizing ways to inform reality, but this is somewhat tricky to describe because the way it happens is, realistically speaking, very relative.
WILL: Mmhm.
ROSE: So information from ego does supply essence very much, and this makes up essence in a big way, but sometimes you might consider that egos are all there are. So egos make up essence, but not in the way that you may think of in the singular sense. Okay?
WILL: Mmhm.
ROSE: So ego does inform in a big way, but not your ego. But that’s why you need to say to your ego that your ego doesn’t hold as much sway as your ego thinks it does. Ego thinks it does hold much sway because it doesn’t realize the vastness of reality, okay? That’s why ego needs to be put in its proper place gently – because ego has taken you from diapers to Divinity in beautiful ways.
So thank ego, but don’t let ego think it’s more than it is. It isn’t, and ego will need to learn that in time. That’s why you’re wanting to express to yourself that you’re essence. Ego will need to learn this, and will soon, because if you meditate, for example, you’ll have more ways to share the information with ego by not only saying to ego, “That’s the way it is because I think that’s the way it is.”
Ego has thinking down pat. Ego doesn’t trust that so much when you say that. So you need to realize, ego needs to experience meditation, for example, to learn how to trust that essence has more in store than it may understand currently. Okay, dear one?
WILL: Very good, yes, thank you.
ROSE: You’re very welcome. Now we’ll open up the floor to more questions if you’d like, dear ones?
PAUL: I just have a comment, and maybe a question will come out of it. I just want to make sure that you’ve been talking about essence and ego tonight, and in Elias’ terms, he uses the term subjective and objective awareness. Are those ontologically equivalent?
ROSE: You’re correct that Elias uses subjective and objective to define ego and inner ego.
PAUL: Okay.
ROSE: Okay, right?
PAUL: Right.
ROSE: Okay. So ego has many facets, and ego can be defined as both inner ego and outer ego, in some ways. Outer ego has some ego to it, as you know, but inner ego does, too. So objective and subjective do apply, in some ways, to ego, yes. They both do.
PAUL: Okay. And I know, because I’ve talked to Elias about this, that there’s also a mediating layer or aspect between the two.[16] So rather than just the duality, there’s a trinity that you can look at, and so on and so forth, as you’ve just kind of pointed out, an outer ego, inner ego, and further inward perhaps.
I also wanted just to throw out Elias’ concept of primary and observing essence,[17] which to me, I cannot prove or disprove. It’s a metaphysical concept that he’s introduced, and the closest thing that’s helped me understand is the movie, Being John Malkovich, where you have focuses going inside of a focus, like the way if I imagine essences observing inside a focus, that some kind of psychological process like that would happen.
But the point I want to make is that ego gets a beating in Eckhart Tolle’s teachings, and as we’re expanding and realizing that ego’s not one-hundred percent creating all its reality, it’s kind of depressing like, “Oh, damn! (Laughs) I was getting so close, I was getting so pumped up that the impossible’s possible, and you know, and I can do this stuff.”
And yet, when I look at this primary and observing essence concept, it shows that essence seeks physical expression in every avenue possible, and so it seeks out ego. What’s it observing? It’s observing objective awareness and outer ego. It’s using outer ego to fulfill its own experience, in a way.
So this boosts ego in a magnificent way. And within All-That-Is, kicking it up to the I-I-I – that trinity that I talk about in that article that Will referred to – ego and essence are highly prized constructions and not to be devalued in anyway whatsoever. Is that correct?
ROSE: Exactly, yes. You’re correct that ego has a vital function in your reality, as well as a fine-tuning of perception, in a sense. It fine-tunes what you observe in intuitive ways, also. So ego has very many skills that are exciting, as well as properly attenuated for your physical reality.
Your reality has to have someone in charge, because you do not get the best objectivity in your way of finding your perceptions. You need ego to do this. So do this well, ego, and you’ll discover that you’ll get more objectivity to your experience by allowing subjectively a sense of essence. So essence will, in many ways, be transferred to ego if ego has the sense that ego will be fine with more essence.
You’re in many ways growing your egos to comprehend more objectively than you do now. Okay? So you’re correct that ego has more to it than is really valued in your psychological terms, as you said, dear one. So try to imagine how your ego will be with more essence in it. It will be subjectively including objective information in ways that are truly spectacular, indeed. So try this at home when you get a chance, (Chuckles) because you’ll find that ego will say, “Ahhh, that feals very, very good. I like that, because you’re honoring me as well as telling me not to fear so much.” Okay? So try this at home, dear ones.
We’ll take more questions if you’d like.
PAUL: Just to follow up there, then: that primary observing essence action is really kind of transdescending action. It is a descending current into physical to promote physicalness and experience physicalness in multitudinous different ways from the essence perspective.
And the other comment is that in most of the world’s religious traditions, the idea then – from an egoic standpoint, in terms of what Elias calls widening of awareness – is to surrender to that which is greater than ego. And in that process of surrendering, you stretch, you thin, you widen to the point where the impossible becomes possible. And what we consider miracles can occur – and I’ve always said this, I believe in miracles, there’s things I can’t rationally explain. But the action then, egoically, of surrendering to essence, surrendering to self, helps to promote the impossible being realized in physical expression. Correct?
ROSE: You’re correct, dear one. (Pause)
PAUL: Okay. (Laughs) I’m done. Amen, brother! (Laughter)
ROSE: Transdescendence is [an] encouragement of self, in many ways, that you don’t currently do, for when you – contrary to your ego self – transdescend, you have the world at your fingertips, okay? The world is you. So to say, “I want to advance beyond the world,” is truly silly. The world is you.
So try to do this. Try to imagine that everything in the world is wanting your benefit, and try to imagine that the world is wanting your every wonderful thing you could possibly need – not even want, but need. When you want to do things, your ego is in charge – this isn’t always a bad thing.
But to say this in a way that would perhaps shock you: the ego is, sometimes, hell. The ego says, “This is hell,” when only your benefit is being looked after by the Earth that is you, that is your essence self talking to you. And we’ll suggest that hell is what the ego does very well, in many ways, when you allow it to find only itself in charge, and not essence. Okay?
So try to imagine that everything that happens is indeed miraculous, and you’ll find also that surrender is a very feminine word – you don’t ever surrender, do you? No.
PAUL: (With mock aggression) Not in business, we never surrender to the competition!
ROSE: Or in militias, or in every way that you can possibly imagine in modern life, correct?
PAUL: And sports teams, yeah.
ROSE: So surrender is a no-no. But we’ll say that there are things that surrender can do for you that striving can never do. And surrender is also fine-tuning things in ways that you’ll find beneficial, too. Surrender has value in suggesting, for example, that to surrender to a situation tunes you into it, then allows you to be in the situation and find ways to believe that you can find ways to absorb the learning from it, then to allow yourself to get the hell out of it. Okay?
So learning happens when you surrender, too, as well as finding things that you will fear less when you truly allow yourself to find surrender, for this is how you can find fearlessness. When you surrender to things, you don’t need to fear them anymore, do you? So do surrender, at times, and then find ways to get the hell out of situations you don’t like very much. Okay?
So do so, and we’ll continue our discussion, dear ones.
BOB: We’re talking about paradox, like Paul and I were discussing during the break. Sometimes you do just the opposite of what you think you should do, and it works!
ROSE: That’s a very geanius way to say that sometimes you need to allow essence to tell you what to do than what your ego self logically believes you should do. So trusting sometimes that alternate ways to approach things is beneficial, is a geanius way to allow more examples of finding value into your world, too.
For example, when you say, “Why do I want to do that anyway?” is sometimes the best example of another path you might provide yourself. So trying to allow yourselves to be in the moment – to allow more ideas about what to do – is an excellent way to get the hell out of your way, and to allow other things to take place, indeed.
So we suggest that’s a geanius way to stay on top of the world, rather than in the bottom of your minds. Okay, dear ones? Your minds only have so much to offer you, indeed. Try to allow them rest. To say this another way, meditation will help your mind rest, and your minds need rest indeed, dear ones.
So do so, and we’ll continue to discuss whatever you’d like to this evening.
TOM: Do our separate focuses have separate egos, and if not, is there a continuity of the ego regardless of the focus?
ROSE: You’re wanting to say another question here, which is sometimes not provoked by ego, and that is, “Is there a super ego in charge, in a sense?” And we need to answer this first. There is, but it is not your ego. Your ego has a sense of the super ego that exists beyond itself, and he will try to connect, in some ways, with this super ego self, but he won’t because he only has dominance in his orbit, in a sense. The super ego has the bigger orbit that the ego self revolves in, in some ways.
So you can imagine the super ego as a sort of planet that circles you always, and your ego self is in you circling in collusion with the super ego self. So your wanting to allow the ego self to feal better is what is implied, in a sense. To say this another way, the ego self is not alone in itself, it has friends in big places, too. So the ego self does allow helpfulness from the super ego source, as well as in his way of spirit, in a sense. Because ego has a way of spirit, but not only in his self, but in essence’s self, too. He only has the best sense that he can in a limited way.
He does connect in some ways with other egos in your focuses, but not to the exciting sense that you might imagine. The ego selves truly need to stand apart, unless there is good reason to say something to each other. For example, you might want to suggest to your other focuses that your ego has more to it than it knows about. The ego self will say, “No that’s not true,” and your ego will say, “That is true,” but that will be the end of the conversation, indeed.
So try to imagine that ego selves only serve in limiting ways until hell freezes over, and you get more to ego selves than you would think of as essence comes into them, indeed. So try to imagine ego self as a sort of finding of solace in essence, as well as in the super ego that surrounds it. Okay, dear one?
TOM: Okay.
ROSE: Okay.
PAUL: Is that super ego similar to this inner ego you just talked about? What’s the difference between the two?
ROSE: The essence self has a sort of ego, and you could call this essence self ego. But the ego is somewhat the same as inner ego, but different. We’ll explain. Inner ego is a sort of inner self that you have to define yourselves in ways that go beyond ego in a very wide sense of the word. So ego has more inner self stuff that is truly wanting to importantly advise ego.
So when your inner self implies to ego what ego must know, inner self takes over the ego. But this is not the ego per se. The super ego is the ego, but only in the addressing of common interests between focuses of essence. The super ego has its own sense of egos in you each as individuals.
So your super ego has the collective ego in mind, but the exchange is sometimes fragmented, so that super ego induces knowledge in your ego, but not totally, in the sense that there is some distortion involved. When the ego says it knows what it knows, sometimes it is not getting all that the super ego has to say. Then it gets stuck, at times, but the inner ego always gets the super ego information.
There’s a sort of inner and outer involved with these two types, but not in the literal sense of the word, because super ego is existing in each of you also, but in a collective sense. To say this another way, the super ego is a continuum that is respectful of ego, both inner and outer. Do you follow dear one?
PAUL: Sort of. Let me try a question that might clarify this. Elias claims to have over 3,000 physical focuses on our planet, one of which is a famous one, Ludwig van Beethoven. So let’s use that cluster as an example. Beethoven’s the focus, Elias is the essence, the super ego is this aspect of the essence of Elias that manages all of his 3,000 focuses in some gestalt fashion, hence super ego. But the inner ego has some kind of mediating function between each individual focus and the super ego – which by the way is not the same as Freud’s super ego,[18] correct?
ROSE: That’s correct. The super ego is not the same as dear Freud’s duplicitous version, for his version was somewhat finding of ascendence as best for all things, always. Super ego has more to it than that. Super ego has some things that your ascending selves don’t have, in that it is very concerned about all things, not just ascending energies. It wants to surely find ways to egoically provide best means for transcendence, but not to the exclusion of descendence. Okay?
This is truly deep information here, so let’s go slowly. Transcendence is truly what you’re seeking now, but the way to do that isn’t in only ascending. Okay? Descending energies are important. This is what we’ve been talking about tonight. So try to imagine that you’re, in every way, descending into the muck of the world when you have physical experiences, and you’ll find that sometimes the muck is where the beauty lies, and in this, the muck is super ego. Okay?
So super ego has your best selves in mind when it tries to allow your experience to help you transcend, and in this, truly what is to follow is absurd sounding, but is not in the big picture. Super ego has a sort of relevance that is funny. It is both truly foundational, as well as truly providing of ways for you to aspire, and so is both your ceiling as well as your floor. So super ego is all that and more.
So your inner egos say, “We want that, but we also want to feal better because, you see, we are sometimes fearing that we’re not good enough. So we want super ego to inform us, but we sometimes get in your way, because we only think in certain ways about things like muck and mire. So we don’t like that, because you’re aware we have learned that we need to always go upwards, and we always need to show how much we’ve achieved, and we always need to find ways to show how high we’ve flown.”
And in this, your very words about supporting features, and surrender, and finding ways to say, “Stay out of the mud,” all say to you that you’re not good enough if you find yourselves face down, but you are. You just don’t see that, and your super ego will try to surely tell you that when you listen to it, and your super ego will try to assure you that whoever you need to be is whoever you want to be, and whoever you want to be is just fine with super ego.
And in this, your ego will say, “Really? But that’s not what we’ve learned so far.” And it will say, “You don’t know what you’re talking about.”
And super ego will say, “You’re correct. You don’t really know what we know.” So it will move into areas that will allow your intuitions to get the information you need. And super ego will, in many ways, work both sides of the situation – in your intuition, as well as your intellect. And your ego is your very broadly defined intellect, in some ways.
So intellect will say, “Egos know best, and we’ll try to allow your ego to do its thing, but we do need to allow your fellow man to also egoically support your ego, for if there’s anything that intrudes on your ego, it’s other egos of other individuals, who lovingly try to support your ego, but know only what they know, too.”
So you’re correct that egos are involved, in many ways, but often are the egos that [fear] the same things that your ego does. So when you realize things like meditation, you connect with essence in ways that allow super ego to speak with ego, and you allow intuition to assuage your beautiful selves’ consciences, as well as fears, in order to truly get the best that you have to offer yourselves, dear ones. Did that answer your question?
PAUL: (Frustrated) No it didn’t at all. I’d like you to address the example I used with Elias and the cluster of focuses.
ROSE: Okay.
PAUL: And the specific focus – one focus in the cluster of 3,000, and how outer ego, inner ego, super ego, work and function, and you can throw in the contrary self if you’re bold enough. (Laughter)
ROSE: Very contrary, dear one…
PAUL: Oh, you got it!
ROSE: …we like that, indeed. (More laughter) So, your Elias is the super ego, in a sense, that allows your egos to connect with him, for Elias is more than that: he’s essence. So he has more to him than you can imagine, and in his Beethoven focus, he has ego, too. So ego has ego as oversouls, in a sense. Beethoven’s oversoul ego is Elias, you might say, and ego selves have other ego selves they talk to.
So Beethoven could talk to dear Oscar Wilde,[19] but they won’t really connect much until they put aside their egos. Do you see how silly this sounds now? So that’s why ego self has to get out of its way and connect with super ego. In this, sometimes Beethoven, in many ways, will speak with Oscar Wilde – in his super ego self, not in his ego self. Okay, dear one?
PAUL: Okay, that was clearer, but where does inner ego factor into those relationships?
ROSE: Inner ego has to do with Beethoven’s selfhood. So inner ego says to Beethoven, “I want to perform without hearing.”
And ego self says, “You’re crazy, Ludwig, you have to hear to play.”
And inner ego says, “You do not.”
And super ego says, “You do not.”
So Elias has a sense of inner ego in Ludwig, but is not exactly tuned into that frequency the same way Ludwig’s inner ego is. Does that answer your question, dear one?
PAUL: It clarifies a little. So within this spectrum of outer, inner, and super ego, where does our contrary self fall?
ROSE: The contrary self is how Ludwig would say to ego self, “You’re crazy to not want to play tonight. You’re crazy for not wanting to say what you want to say in music.”
And your contrary self does this constantly. It says, “You’re crazy for that, but we want to assure you that that’s exactly what you need to do – be crazy. We want you to express yourself in ways that you do not. So take it from us: you’re crazy, we want you to express yourself.”
And you’ll do well to consider that contrary self was very strong in Ludwig van Beethoven. He held court in ways that were contrary. He only did what he wanted to do. He didn’t always get the ways of spirit in healthy ways, but he did want to say things that others did not want him to say.
He did that, and his contrary self was there all along, saying, “We want you to do that, Ludwig.” He did, and the contrary self loved him through the entire thing, for that’s what the contrary self does: it loves you no matter what you want to do, in every way.
So the contrary self was, in some ways, Ludwig’s refuge in his later expressions especially. And he was, in many ways, the contrary self that he wanted to be, because ego self was sometimes threatened by the contrary self. But he did allow this to occur in beautiful ways that brought in some pain, yes, but he did excellently provide himself a beautifully composed expression of a single lifetime that was, in many ways, shared among all your focuses, indeed, as well as many dimensions.
So you’re correct to use Ludwig van Beethoven as an example that is very providing of understanding, for he was extremely contrary, and that’s exactly what it takes to do what you need to do in the world. For even when he was face down in the mud, he held his ground, and he held yours as well, because in his way of spirit, he indeed did perform miracles that you still – still – do appreciate even today. So do consider him a very excellent model in contrariness, indeed, and descendence as well.
Now we aren’t hearing any protests (Paul laughs) from you, dear one, about our lack of clarity now, are we?
PAUL: No, thank you, that was helpful. I know when you introduce new material it takes time to get the head and heart around it. So it’s a process. I’m more familiar with it at this point, so I’m allowing my intellect to get out of the way a bit, and just let it subjectively filter in like Joyce has been doing (Laughter) for the last twenty minutes.[20]
GEORGE: If it would help, just think of Scruffy McGee.
PAUL: (Laughs) I know, I’m right there with you – Scruffy McGee.
GEORGE: It’s the same like I told you.
PAUL: So thank you.
ROSE: Thank you, dear one, for your questions were excellently posed, and we do very much appreciate them.
GEORGE: Rose, can I pull a Boris[21] on you? Would you mind? (Laughter)
ROSE: Boris…
PAUL: Are you channeling Boris?
ROSE: …sometimes does provide contrary measures to get the best from Rose, as well as from you. So we will say, yes, that’s another wonderful contrary model, dear George.
GEORGE: My question was, how does Rose go about accessing all this information about focuses and about life in general? Let’s say that Elias has all these focuses, and Seth – we all have them – and yet Rose doesn’t. So it’s like, everything we have, it’s held somewhere and you’re capable of tapping into it?
And you say, “Well this might work better for you fellows,” because obviously you’re not talking from your own personal experience. That’s what you made me understand so far?
ROSE: That’s correct.
GEORGE: You have never had any physical focuses. So you study Seth in the meantime, or Elias, and how does it work for you? Because whichever one works for you, works for us, too, but still….
ROSE: That’s correct. The way you have for yourselves is somewhat the way Rose does her thing, too. We’ll explain.
When you get up in the morning, what do you do? (Humorously) You brush your teeth, perhaps – we do hope so, indeed. (Laughter) So we do not brush our teeth. We do not have many ways to “time out,” so to speak, as you do. You time out every night when you sleep. You move into timeless areas of consciousness. That’s where we are, timeless-wise.
So you have more to do with Rose than you might imagine you do. So when you realize that we’re there with you, then you can imagine that you are very knowing of us there, and we’re very knowing of you there, as well. We are always there. You’re not always there. You’re here in this state now. We are, too, but not in the same way. We do not incorporate focuses of attention like you do, but we do feal you – excitedly, too.
To say this another way, we are you, but in a way that you are not remembering right now, but you do when you sleep, for you get into brain consciousness that allows your information to pollinate with ours. So we do allow your information into our scope, and you allow your information from us into your scope every day, but in some ways we’re in a different place, that’s all.
We’re you. We are Rose, and we do not have more physical focuses than would be expressed, in some ways, as “alternate selves.”[22] We do have expressions of Rose like what you are seeing now, but we don’t have ways of getting into you like you do now with your own essence self. We only paint pictures with brushes. We’re not the paintings themselves.
This is sometimes hard to say, but we have more to you than you know. We are more than you can express, too. So we’re you in ways that you can’t imagine yet. To say this another way, we’re beyond you, but we’re also in you, too. So we’re a really big essence self. However you look at us, we do know you very well in spite of the fact that we don’t have focuses of attention ourselves.
We do have some in ways that you’ll find funny. We are excited to tell you that we’re Elias, because we’re Elias now, too, as well as when he speaks.[23] We do move around a lot, us essences. So Rose is a sort of collective that you’ll be able to see in time. When you’re not physical, you’ll have more to see than you do now. We suggest you’ll only shift perspective, not become really much different than you are now. You’ll find ways to see more later on than you do now.
This is not to say that you’re seeing only wrong things now – you’re not. You’re seeing what you need to see, which is why we allow the information about descending energies. The way you’ve chosen to live your focused lives is beautiful in every way, and you need to allow yourselves to do this, not to become like us. We’re like us, you’re like you. So celebrate that, and allow us to be here in spirit with you.
That’s all we’re trying to say in every session we do with you: to allow you to be who you are, and allow yourselves to enjoy your very wonderful lives, indeed. So try to imagine us as somehow assisting in that, only in ways that you’ll find acceptable, indeed. For you don’t need us to tell you what to do. We test you to ensure that you don’t, because we want you express to yourselves what you need to do, and not realize only the teachers in your days to tell you things that you should know even better than they do.
So trust that we do want you to find essence in you, and we’ll always do this no matter how we may realize connection with you. In your dreams, in the bird’s songs, in many ways, we do connect with you in every way possible. Okay?
So did we answer your question, dear one?
GEORGE: Kind of.
ROSE: Okay. We will say also that you’re wanting to express that Rose is sometimes very cagey, and this is truly accurate, because we can’t say some things that you feal would be intrusive. We do [not want to] intrude on your experiences too much. There is a sort of code that we have to inspire you, but not to intrude on you. Okay? So that’s why we sometimes come across as cagey, because we don’t want to sound too egg-headed. We do know how to be egg-headed, but you don’t need that in your days, you only need our energetic assistance sometimes. Okay?
Any other questions, dear ones? We’ll say that you’ve been wonderful this evening in your questions.
PAUL: Ursula has one.
ROSE: Okay. Go ahead.
URSULA: Speaking of the focuses, do you, Rose, experience all of our focuses in this world while here with us?
ROSE: We do. We know you very well indeed. We know you so well that we don’t tell you things about yourselves that you don’t want to know, indeed. So when you realize that the way of spirit is, in many ways, a closed door for you to open, that’s when we’ll express to you more information about your focuses.
To say this in a way that may sound really bad, you need to open the door to yourselves before Rose gives you information that you’ll find helpful. Okay? That’s why we say to study information that we give you, so we can test you, (Joanne laughs) as well as to find ways to truly help you with that door. Okay? So do so.
And we’ll say also that you’re correct that the focus you have with the weany boy is correct. That will be all we’ll say. We’re being very cagey tonight, indeed. So try to remember what the information was that you got about the focus with dear weany boy, and we’ll say more about that at another time, okay?
Any other questions?
BOB: You can tell oversoul names?[24]
ROSE: Yes we do, and we have essence names in store for you indeed, as well. We will do the essence names, indeed. So don’t worry that essence names will not be used by Rose – they will be – and you’ll do well to find ways to incorporate essence names into your own means of finding your way of spirit. We suggest that essence names will be the ways you can signal to yourselves the ways that you find in the way of spirit.
In other words, the essence names will be your intent names. This is a test in many ways, because you could say that your intent names are the ones that Elias gave you, and this will be okay by us. But to say this in ways that mean something to you is why you need to think about how you wish to depict yourselves to the world, and in this, the essence names are synonymous with your intent names. So try to do the intent name exercise,[25] and we’ll suggest that this be your essence name as well. Okay, dear ones? So try the exercise in the coming weeks, and we’ll say more about this at the next session, indeed. Okay?
GEORGE: (Humorously) Well Rose, if this cageyness is going to continue, I’m just going to go join a church or something. (Laughter) I don’t have to put up with this cageyness stuff here.
ROSE: Finding your answers in books, dear George, is what got you into the trouble you’re in today, in some respects. So try to remember that, and we’ll say more about that at another time. And we’ll also want to say that you’re correct that cageyness is indeed not fun, but sometimes it is a geanius way of spirit. Okay?
GEORGE: Okay.
ROSE: Okay.
PAUL: Keeping you on your toes!
BOB: Make you think for yourself.
PAUL: (Sarcastically) Welcome to my world! (Laughter)
ROSE: Weany boy is correct. The tests are very hard at times. So try to remember that we’re doing this because we do love you very much, and being contrary is sometimes the best way to show your love to others, indeed.
So we’ll say adieu for tonight, unless there are any further comments or questions?
PAUL: Our phone time is has run over.
ROSE: Okay.
PAUL: They don’t kick you off as long as there’s room on the phone bridge.
ROSE: Okay, we’ll say, “Thank you to Will, and the bridge.”
GEORGE: Bye Will.
WILL: Thank you.
ROSE: And we’ll say also, “We look forward to seeing you in the real world, dear Will.”
WILL: Yes.
ROSE: And we’ll talk to you at another time. We’ll say, “Adieu to you all for the evening, dear ones. Go forth and be contrary, indeed. Okay? Goodnight.”
PAUL: Thank you, Rose.
(Rose departs: 7:39 PM.)
PAUL: Go forth and be contrary!
(Transcribed by Andrew McCusker, October 12, 2008.)
Check out Paul's Review of this Session.
Endnotes
[1] Paul’s note: This is one of Rose’s neologisms (made-up words), a combination of gene and genius. For more info, see The Rose Glossary.
[2] Joanne’s note: I had been afraid that my frequent bathroom trips beforehand would disrupt the session. Put another way, I didn’t want the shit to disrupt my plans! Thanks for sharing, Rose! Her transparency about my personal challenges seems to be part of my ongoing process of letting go of fears, including those about what people think of me, which is part of being a channeler or doing anything that people don’t expect or accept – in other words, being contrary. Rose serves as my contrary self, who I interact with in objective space as well as subjective space, which is where it lives in everyone, whether or not we choose to converse with her.
[3] Paul’s note: This is one of Rose’s neologisms (made-up words), a combination of feel and real. For more info, see The Rose Glossary.
[4] Paul’s note: For more on the contrary self, see The Beautiful Contrary Self: An Introduction.
[5] Paul’s note: This is one of Rose’s neologisms (made-up words), a combination of create and Christ. For more info, see The Rose Glossary.
[6] Paul’s note: Sontering is the action of “breathing in essence,” or using the breath to realize that essence is all around us, inside and outside. For more info, see Sontering (Breathe in Your Essence Practice).
[7] Paul’s note: The term holon was coined by Arthur Koestler to mean a “whole-part” or one made of many to show that any unit (whole) we discern is simultaneously made up of subunits (parts). This concept has been highly developed by Ken Wilber’s integral theory to help flesh out a systems theory approach to reality creation in terms of individual and social holons.
For example, in The Education of Oversoul Seven by Jane Roberts, Sumpter attends a dream tribunal where Oversoul Seven makes an appearance. Sumpter perceives Seven as “one made of many” or an oversoul made up of many human personalities. Sumpter, is also “one made of many” but in terms of a human focus personality consisting of organs, cells, molecules, quantum fields and so on. Therefore, Sumpter and Seven are two very different types of individual holons.
The larger point is that each holon will have a type of nested free will in relation to its super- and subholons. In this context, then, reality creation is an incredible array of nested relationships, each with its own type or species of free will and choice, all jointly creating and co-creating. For more info, see Seth on “The Origins of the Universe and of the Species” ~ An Integral Conscious Creation Myth.
[8] Paul’s note: Rose referred to a popular psychologist named Dr. Phil McGraw who has a TV show.
[9] Paul’s note: Rose’s first series of detailed communications with Joanne were entitled Nun’s Ways. Rose used the nun metaphor from Jo’s Catholic background, but a redefined version that is more aligned with the authentic contemplative traditions of women “nuns.” I was struck by the feminine connotations and its potential to express the rising Divine Feminine principle that is part of the current edge of evolutionary unfolding, for example, the increased use of intuition, emotions, feelings, and subjective knowing. In other words, we are not talking about stereotypical contemporary nuns, but those who were deeply involved with Christianity’s esoteric traditions, and earlier. Also, Rose’s definition of a nun is not limited to female gender, as she considers me a “nun” as well (much to my amusement). So Rose uses “nun” in a much broader symbolic definition to encourage the transformative practices handed down over the millennia by woman contemplatives.
[10] Paul’s note: Here’s an excerpt to illustrate my point from Awakening to a New Earth (2005):
“In a wider sense of the word, the ego itself is pathological, no matter what form it takes [my emphasis]. When we look at the ancient Greek root of the word pathological, we discover just how appropriate that term is when applied to the ego. Although the word is normally used to describe a condition of disease, it is derived from pathos, which means suffering. This is, of course, exactly what the Buddha already discovered 2,600 years ago as a characteristic of the human condition.
“A person in the grip of ego, however, does not recognize suffering as suffering, but will look upon it as the only appropriate response in any given situation. The ego in its blindness is incapable of seeing the suffering it inflicts on itself and on others. Unhappiness is an ego-created mental-emotional disease that has reached epidemic proportions. It is the inner equivalent of the environmental pollution of our planet.” ~ pp. 109-110.
What Eckhart Tolle fails to understand is that ego is a natural developmental condition of human evolution to date. To blindly label all forms of ego as pathological confuses natural healthy egoic stages of development with its pathological versions across the board. Thus, his writings suffer, pun intended, from its own “sinful self” influences, which are remnants of the ascendant spiritual traditions – i.e., our purpose is to escape the hellish wheel of Samsara, or the delusions of Maya – that consider transegoic development to be the only “healthy” form of human existence, something Ken Wilber estimates is less than one one-hundred thousandth of one percent or .00001% of our global population. In other words, 99.99999% of humanity to date has NOT evolved beyond egoic stages of development! [“A Spirituality That Transforms,” Shambhala, Boston, MA, 1996.]
[11] Paul’s note: “The sinful self” was coined by Jane Roberts to identify a pathological subpersonality (Aspect) of her psyche that greatly contributed to her chronic physical symptoms, illness, and death at age 54. Based on Jane’s Catholic upbringing, the sinful self considered her a flawed, sinful creature by act of birth. That flaw, based on the belief systems of “original sin” and “the heavy unkind mark of Cain,” may only be redeemed through salvation in the acceptance of Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. Jane felt that her pioneering work with The Seth Material may have steered people away from those kinds of Church dogmas. But she wondered what if she was wrong, inadvertently leading her readers down a primrose path? Thus, her “sinful self” provided a kind of protection against potential rejection down the road, in spite the success of the Seth books, as though lens of history may reveal that she was indeed a charlatan.
“So in a fashion [Jane’s] physical symptoms became a psychological disclaimer, so that in some court of larger values we could not be ‘sued’ for leading others astray from entrenched beliefs that we were still discarding, while not having any completed structure that would allow easy access of safe passage from one ‘life raft’ to the new one that we were trying to provide….
“Therefore the disclaimer was necessary to protect myself and others from any fatal flaw in our work—a flaw that sin’s blindness made invisible….” ~ Dreams, “Evolution,” and Value Fulfillment, Vol. 1, (1986), p. 41.
While the Seth material is a transcendental body of work, its purpose is not to deny the flesh in terms of the “ascending” perennial traditions that end up devaluing the “descended” material world. Nor is it intended to perpetuate the idea of “the sinful self” that says we are all flawed creatures from birth or trapped in an endless cycle of reincarnations and suffering by default. Nor is it a purely “descended” tradition that glorifies only the five senses at the expense of the inner senses. It is a middle way, opening to door toward the remembrance of self, developing psychic abilities, balancing intellect and intuition, physical and inner senses, while nurturing healthy body/minds and pursuing maximum value fulfillment on individual and collective levels.
[12] Joanne’s note: The Grapes of Wrath, written by John Steinbeck, is about the Joad family. Their crops destroyed in the Dust Bowl and their farm repossessed, they pack all their possessions in a truck and drive to beautiful and fruitful California, only to encounter more misfortune. According to Wikipedia, “the title is a reference to some lyrics from ‘The Battle Hymn of the Republic’, by Julia Ward Howe: ‘Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord: He is trampling out the vintage where the grapes of wrath are stored…’ These lyrics refer, in turn, to the biblical passage Revelation 14:19-20, an apocalyptic appeal to divine justice and deliverance from oppression in the final judgment. ‘And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God’ ... The image invoked by the title serves as a crucial symbol in the development of both the plot and the novel's greater thematic concerns: From the terrible winepress of Dust Bowl oppression will come terrible wrath but also the deliverance of workers through their cooperation.”
[13] Joanne’s note: Mike works as a trader and co-owner of fruit farms, so the example is interestingly fitting.
[14] Joanne’s note: The song was Natalie Merchant’s “Wonder” (lyrics below).
Doctors have come from distant cities just to see me
stand over my bed disbelieving what they're seeing
they say I must be one of the wonders of god's own creation
and as far as the can see they can offer no explanation
newspapers ask intimate questions what confessions
they reach into my head to steal the glory of my story
they say I must be one of the wonders of god's own creation
and as far as the can see they can offer no explanation
I believe fate smiled and destiny
laughed as she came to my cradle know this child will be able
laughed as my body she lifted know this child will be gifted
with love, with patience and with faith she'll make her way
people see me I'm a challenge to your balance
I'm over your heads how I confound you and astound you
to know I must be one of the wonders of god's own creation …
When researching this footnote, I noticed that Natalie Merchant wrote another song named “Dust Bowl,” an interesting synchronicity in regard to The Grapes of Wrath that Rose refers to in this passage. The lyrics also seem prophetic in regard to the current economic downturn: “Pennies, nickels, dollars slip away. I've tried and tried but I can't save. The hole in my pocketbook is growing. There's a new wind blowing they say, it's gonna be a cold, cold one. So brace yourselves my darlings, it won't bring anything much our way but more dust bowl days.”
[15] Paul’s note: For more info, see Who is the “You” in You Create Your Reality?
[16] Paul’s note: Here’s an excerpt from Session 1246, January 16, 2003:
PAUL: So in that sense, just to use Seth’s model, this outer ego/subconscious/inner ego structure has all of these streams – this communicating self, mathematical self, kinesthetic body movement athletic ability self – that covers all of these, they’re all – in other words, it’s not just a function of the waking, outer ego, physical body, it’s really supported by this whole nested structure that’s invisible; there’s invisible aspects that we’re trying to discern and understand, in my terms.
ELIAS: Correct, which are the qualities and the expressions, which are those that you term to be invisible. Expressions that are unseen in a physical sense, but are quite real and quite present and expressed.
PAUL: And affecting, influencing this change-in-time sequence that we all go through.
ELIAS: Correct. Quite correct. In this, I may express to you a similarity, although you are correct that I have offered two identifications as opposed to the three, but in other terms it may be viewed as three in a connected sense.
PAUL: Mmhm. Sure.
ELIAS: For there’s an incorporation of different terms, but the meaning is basically the same.
PAUL: We’re talking about the same spectrum of consciousness, whether we say it’s a 100 degrees in Centigrade or 212 degrees in Fahrenheit, it doesn’t matter.
ELIAS: Correct.
PAUL: It does matter, but we need to be aware of those distinctions, because we can distort things if we get too locked into the terminology.
ELIAS: Yes, the terminology may be different, but it matters not.
PAUL: It’s covering the same spectrum.
ELIAS: Yes. In this, I may express to you that there may be an identification of the objective awareness, the subjective awareness, and what you term to be in between, or the subconscious. In this, you may be identifying the action of communication, which, in your terms, within your translation of thought, translates into the link between the two, of the objective and the subjective.
[17] Paul’s note: Elias’ claims that every focus of attention or lifetime contains a primary (directing) essence. However, it may also be simultaneously merged with secondary (observing) essences. This metaphysical concept greatly expands the idea that we are multidimensional beings. For more info, see Digests: aspects of essence; primary (directing)/secondary (observing).
[18] Paul’s note: Sigmund Freud mapped the human psyche and related behaviors into three mental structures: id (it), ego (I), and superego (over-I). Id is equated with prepersonal stages of childhood development dominated by the pleasure principle and instant gratification, disregarding the needs of all others. Ego is equated with the adult stages of development dominated by an understanding of compromise and the ability to relate to other’s needs along with one’s own. Superego is equated with the moral aspects of parental and societal behavioral norms, and strives to balance personal needs within social rules. This simple trinity has been greatly modified and expanded by later Schools of Psychology including Humanistic, Transpersonal, and Integral.
[19] Paul’s note: Elias also claims to have Oscar Wilde (1854-1900) as one of his focuses.
[20] Paul’s note: Joyce had experienced a long day, and had fallen asleep during the tail end of the session.
[21] Paul’s note: Boris attended several sessions in the late Spring, and asked a lot of interesting and sometimes contrary questions of Rose and the group.
[22] Paul’s note: Elias introduced the notion of alternate selves in relation to each focus of attention or lifetime. In short, they form a myriad of subpersonalities or Aspects selves that make up our total focus personality. For example, we can have a wounded child, protector, inner skeptic, parent, healer, and so on. These subpersonae surface one at a time, so as to create a constant array of alternate selves. Moreover, they are different than probable selves, as each probable has its own myriad of alternate selves. For more info, see Digests: alternate selves.
So Rose is using this metaphysical concept to suggest how her native focus of attention can relate to us in the physical domain without having ever engaged a full cycle of physical manifestation.
[23] Paul’s note: I made the following chart based on conversations with Cathy Churchman in 1999 based on her understanding of essence fragmentation in the Elias information. It shows how Rose may function as a “progenitor essence,” and supports the notion that Rose has no physical focuses, but can vicariously experience physical focuses through merging with our essences. For example, note that my essence (Caroll) is fragmented from three essences, two of which (Otha and Ordin) are directly fragmented from Rose, and Joanne’s essence (Tyl) is a fragment (Patel) of a fragmented essence (Otha):
Again, these are linearized versions of nonlinear, nonphysical relationships. As such, the chart is only suggestive of the deeper metaphysical realities that we don’t yet fully understand. For more info, see Digests: fragmentation.
[24] Paul’s note: To my current knowledge, Seth, channeled by Jane Roberts from 1963-1984 was the first source to provide what he called “entity names.” For instance, Seth consistently referred to Jane as Ruburt and husband Rob Butts as Joseph. Elias, Kris, and Rose continue this trend. However, Rose does not consistently use entity or essence names (as Elias calls them) at this stage. You will observe that she will also use first names and even made up names, like Scruffy McGee, and in this case, she was prodding the group to explore the intent name practice. For more info, see Digests: essence names.
[25] Paul’s note: This is a foundational practice that Rose uses to help us discover our intent. For more info, see Discover Your Intent Name.